basifying iso for poppy extract

cheech · 07-13-07, 06:14

my friend recently completed an alcohol poppy pod extract. he added lye to both iso and methyl alcohols bringing the ph up to 9, powdered pods were then added to the two alcohols. ph was adjusted back up to 9 as adding the pod powder caused a drop. due to some clumsiness he forgot which alcohol was which. the lids of the containers were labeled and got mixed up. he tells me the extracts done at ph 9 were far superior to those using straight alcohol.

synth · 07-13-07, 06:43

any pics of the product?
also, what's the result, something opium-like?
sounds good..

cheech · 07-14-07, 09:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by synth

any pics of the product?
also, what's the result, something opium-like?
sounds good..

i'll be able to post a picture in another day or two. the result was very opium like. he told me he first tried to extract using just iso with no ph adjustment. the solution had very little color. but after raising the ph of the iso it had a very deep bluish color. he also mentioned that there was a distinct difference between the iso and methyl extracts colorwise, but as the lids were mixed up he had no way to tell which was which. from what i've read about extracting the alkaloids from pods (or even opium) the ph adjustment makes sense.
he hipped me to a readily available source of both iso and methyl alcohols (100%) at a good price. pm me if you'd like more info.

exitium · 07-17-07, 12:19

would the same principle apply when doing alcohol extraction on cactus?

synth · 07-17-07, 13:42

not really

rocketman · 07-17-07, 20:44

My everclear poppy extractions are dark green, just like cactus. I found that they are not very efficient much like the alcohol cactus extract. You can actually use alcohol to get a tar, go back and boil your pulp to a tea and reduce in a glass baking dish to get a brown chocolate smelling substance that is quite potent but tastes like shit. Maybe the ph adjustment makes them more efficient than plain alcohol, i am not convinced that it would be much better than a good boiling.

Godflesh · 07-22-07, 15:00

What happens to the lye after evap? Doesn't it remain in resulting material?

theDarkness · 07-25-07, 16:27

Im sure youd have to clean the final product. Mabey with naptha? Im not sure if that would work with this. I know one thing, Id be VERY careful when testing this product. Especialy if theres a possiblity of lye in the final product. G'Luck. -Dark

Godflesh · 07-25-07, 16:36

No doubt! Some feedback would be good on this.

Lefty · 07-25-07, 19:09

Lye is for the A/B extraction, post-sep funnel it is gone.

Caljet666 · 07-26-07, 05:55

I see what Rodeye is sayin' here as there was no separation performed.

The reason the PH dropped when the pods were added is because the lye and the acidic salts of the alkaloids react together, liberating the alkaloids of their salt and they are then in there freebase form. I don't think you would have had to add more lye.

Godflesh · 07-26-07, 11:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caljet666

I see what Rodeye is sayin' here as there was no separation performed.

The reason the PH dropped when the pods were added is because the lye and the acidic salts of the alkaloids react together, liberating the alkaloids of their salt and they are then in there freebase form. I don't think you would have had to add more lye.

Cool Caljet! But, how can one remove Lye and clean this up?

Caljet666 · 07-26-07, 12:36

I've no experience with poppies but I'm pretty sure the freebase alkaloids wont dissolve with water so you could flush with distilled water I guess.

Or you could add tiny drops of dilute hydrochloric acid until it was neutral. Sounds nasty but when lye and hcl acid react and become neutral you are left with salt and water. PH 7 at 25 deg C is netural.

NaOH + HCl ---> H2O + NaCl

Na = Sodium
O = Oxygen
H = Hydrogen
Cl = Chlorine

Notice there are the same amount of atoms on each side of the equation. Of course, you will never get this perfect but done carefully you should end up with so little HCl or NaOH that it shouldn't matter. Also your alkaloids would then be attached to thier HCl salt. Most medicine from the chemist is a HCl salt but the freebase would be more desirable if you were going to smoke it.

Peace
Caljet

Godflesh · 07-26-07, 12:56

Cool! Thanks for the info! I do happen to have some Muratic acid around! Need to get some PH paper though! So, are you telling me that it is ok to smoke, as is, or do I still need to remove Lye? Thanks again!

Caljet666 · 07-26-07, 13:14

NaOH boils at 1390 deg C so smoking should be fine.

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07-13-07, 06:14	#1 (permalink)
cheech Mycotopiate Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 423	basifying iso for poppy extract my friend recently completed an alcohol poppy pod extract. he added lye to both iso and methyl alcohols bringing the ph up to 9, powdered pods were then added to the two alcohols. ph was adjusted back up to 9 as adding the pod powder caused a drop. due to some clumsiness he forgot which alcohol was which. the lids of the containers were labeled and got mixed up. he tells me the extracts done at ph 9 were far superior to those using straight alcohol. __________________ greater vehicle, lesser vehicle. it does not matter, all vehicles will be towed at the owner's expense.

07-17-07, 20:44	#6 (permalink)
rocketman GATE KEEPER Join Date: Feb 1971 Posts: 3,291	My everclear poppy extractions are dark green, just like cactus. I found that they are not very efficient much like the alcohol cactus extract. You can actually use alcohol to get a tar, go back and boil your pulp to a tea and reduce in a glass baking dish to get a brown chocolate smelling substance that is quite potent but tastes like shit. Maybe the ph adjustment makes them more efficient than plain alcohol, i am not convinced that it would be much better than a good boiling. __________________ robbing a man of his cherished delusions does not make you any wealthier, it just makes him poorer. H3

07-22-07, 15:00	#7 (permalink)
Godflesh Mycotopiate Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 612	What happens to the lye after evap? Doesn't it remain in resulting material? __________________ Eye am Why am Eye

07-25-07, 16:36	#9 (permalink)
Godflesh Mycotopiate Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 612	No doubt! Some feedback would be good on this. __________________ Eye am Why am Eye

07-13-07, 06:43	#2 (permalink)
synth Mycotopiate Join Date: Aug 1972 Posts: 758	any pics of the product? also, what's the result, something opium-like? sounds good..

07-17-07, 12:19	#4 (permalink)
exitium Mycophiliac Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 21	would the same principle apply when doing alcohol extraction on cactus?

07-17-07, 13:42	#5 (permalink)
synth Mycotopiate Join Date: Aug 1972 Posts: 758	not really

07-25-07, 16:27	#8 (permalink)
theDarkness Fell On Black Days Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 52	Im sure youd have to clean the final product. Mabey with naptha? Im not sure if that would work with this. I know one thing, Id be VERY careful when testing this product. Especialy if theres a possiblity of lye in the final product. G'Luck. -Dark

07-25-07, 19:09	#10 (permalink)
Lefty Resident Evil Join Date: Jan 1970 Posts: 2,018	Lye is for the A/B extraction, post-sep funnel it is gone. __________________ Blood crystalized to sand And now I hope you'll understand

07-26-07, 05:55	#11 (permalink)
Caljet666 Dumbass Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 245	I see what Rodeye is sayin' here as there was no separation performed. The reason the PH dropped when the pods were added is because the lye and the acidic salts of the alkaloids react together, liberating the alkaloids of their salt and they are then in there freebase form. I don't think you would have had to add more lye. __________________ ?

07-26-07, 12:36	#13 (permalink)
Caljet666 Dumbass Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 245	I've no experience with poppies but I'm pretty sure the freebase alkaloids wont dissolve with water so you could flush with distilled water I guess. Or you could add tiny drops of dilute hydrochloric acid until it was neutral. Sounds nasty but when lye and hcl acid react and become neutral you are left with salt and water. PH 7 at 25 deg C is netural. NaOH + HCl ---> H2O + NaCl Na = Sodium O = Oxygen H = Hydrogen Cl = Chlorine Notice there are the same amount of atoms on each side of the equation. Of course, you will never get this perfect but done carefully you should end up with so little HCl or NaOH that it shouldn't matter. Also your alkaloids would then be attached to thier HCl salt. Most medicine from the chemist is a HCl salt but the freebase would be more desirable if you were going to smoke it. Peace Caljet __________________ ? Last edited by Caljet666 : 07-26-07 at 12:38. Reason: Spelling

07-26-07, 12:56	#14 (permalink)
Godflesh Mycotopiate Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 612	Cool! Thanks for the info! I do happen to have some Muratic acid around! Need to get some PH paper though! So, are you telling me that it is ok to smoke, as is, or do I still need to remove Lye? Thanks again! __________________ Eye am Why am Eye

07-26-07, 13:14	#15 (permalink)
Caljet666 Dumbass Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 245	NaOH boils at 1390 deg C so smoking should be fine. __________________ ?

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