Non toxic, food safe extraction of mescaline and related alkaloids

[kcmoxtractor]

This idea was started by 69ron over at the DMTnexus. For original tek see here- http://wiki.dmt-nexus.com/69ron%27s_D-Limonene_Mescaline_Extraction
I am also combining the mescaline salting using carbonated water (carbonic acid, mescaline carbonate) here- http://www.dmt-nexus.com/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=6310

Materials-

1 gal milk jug to make carbonate salts in
1 one qt Mason jar to make acetate salts in
Evaporation dish
Funnel (I used 2L bottle neck.)
Coffee filters, 3 or so
Plastic milk jug or similar HDPE or PP5 container - not polystyrene
100 grams cactus powder (can be Achuma, pedro or torch)
25 grams calcium hydroxide
900mL d-limonene
300mL water
3L Carbonated water

It uses all food safe ingredients for the extraction and salting of the alkaloids. Calcium hydroxide can be bought at most W****** stores and d-limonene is sold as orange oil, might have to call around to find some.

I started with 200g powdered trich. bridgesii cactus.





I added 50g calcium hydroxide and 1200mL water. (The tek only calls for 600mL h20, and this was kind of a stupid mistake on my part, it SAYS that your yield is reduced when you add too much water, but I have pulled 1.7% already I think it would be easier to work with if you only add 600 though.) When you add the 600mL of water to 200g of cactus it will seem wet, but not watery. Looks like bread dough or something. Mine does not illustrate this, but here is the picture I have.






Pull One:


Add 600mL of d-limonene to cactus mixture and let it sit for about 6 hours. Decant the d-limonene from the top of the cactus and add 50mL of standard food grade 5% vinegar.





Decanted limonene into separate 1g milk jug. At this point I evaporated the first vinegar salting to see what would be yielded and it was this-





After this I salted the limonene with vinegar two more times, then added the carbonated water. Picture below. When you add the carbonated water, shake it several times, but be sure to release the pressure or the lid will shoot off. First pull yielded 2.1g of waxy crystalline substance.










Pull Two:


Add another 600 mL of limonene to the top of the cactus. You can remove this in several hours, but I let mine sit for several days, and a very wicked third layer formed.





I added 10g more base and put it in a hot water bath at this point and the layer seemed to become more well defined, allowing me to separate the second limonene pull.





Salted second pull with vinegar twice and carbonated water, then evaporated to yield 1.3 g waxy crystalline substance.




So far I have yielded 3.4g of acetate and carbonate salts, or 1.7% and that is just from the first two pulls.

My third pull is in the carbonate salting step right now, As soon as it is finished I will update this thread.



I have more pictures here- http://forums.mycotopia.net/members/...-t-achuma.html


If you have any questions, Feel Free to ask!

[wildburr]

Nice , Gonna pull up a chair for this one.

[bbd2]

tst tsk tsk bad bad bad

that achuma was used in a manner inconsistent with its labeling



nice work

love the pic of the acetate
random folks always claim its a goo

[kcmoxtractor]

Well it kind of is a goo but when you scrape it up the first time it dries out more... it is like waxy crystals, that first picture looked like the second when I first scraped it up, but it easily rolls into little balls.

[themallacht]

How does one know how much to take of this? Is there a way of compensating for the waxy substance that's in it and figuring about how many mg one is taking? Or perhaps one of you could share personal experience on this...?

[kcmoxtractor]

You start with your dosage in cacti. I started with 200g of cacti, two really good doses. I think I am just going to eat half of it at once and my girl is going to eat the other half.

This is not really a large scale extraction, more for a personal amount of product or for you and a couple of friends. They have their dosages on the original page. Apparently if you're not hardheaded about 300mg is a pretty psychedelic dose. A lot of people on there say that even 80mg is mildly active and long lasting.

[Fly on the Wall]

Originally Posted by themallacht

How does one know how much to take of this? Is there a way of compensating for the waxy substance that's in it and figuring about how many mg one is taking? Or perhaps one of you could share personal experience on this...?

The tek's creator recommends no more than 0.2g for a first-time experience. Supposedly that's enough to be reasonably psychedelic without 'jumping into the deep end', always a good strategy with a new drug that one may be unusually sensitive to.

Also, if one really wanted pure Mesc HCL instead of the waxy acetate, adding just enough 10% HCL to dissolve the acetate will turn it into Mesc HCL which can then be washed with acetone and IPA. A lot of interesting info is available here: http://wiki.dmt-nexus.com/69ron%27s_...ine_Extraction

Much respect to kcmo for making the thread. This tek being food-safe makes it accessible to more people and could even save a life of someone who could have had an accident with solvents or strong bases.

[whatchamacallit]

SWIM will have to acquire some fumaric acid, d-limonene, some cactus powder and give the tek a try. He is not sure how only 300mgs is such a wild ride, perhaps it's the achuma cactus's extra alkaloids. Maybe they are pulled out as well, since the lower pH (when made basic, 10 or 11, instead of 14) in the extraction and alkaloids solubility in the d-limonene.

SWIM doubts everyone at the nexus are lightweights, so he'll have to see if the pure mesc HCl from both extractions (regular solvent and lye, or d-limonene and sodium carbonate), and then compare the extracts from the achuma cactus, and see the differences. With his pure mescaline HCl, a gram to a gram and a half of the crystals, gives him a powerful experience, however 500mgs is decent ride, just not super powerful.

Has anyone over at the nexus said their mesc HCl from this tek, is stronger than their mesc HCl from the teks with xylene and lye? Or is the hypothesis that it's the added alkaloids from the bridgesii (Achuma) that are pulled with the d-limonene and sodium carbonate?

[kcmoxtractor]

Mescaline Fumarate apparently isn't that active. They claim that the HCl isn't as active by weight as the acetate, even though they have a very similar molecular weight. 69ron talked about fumarate in one of the cactus threads, said that the come up took forever and the peak wasn't that strong. They also say that the acetate comes on fairly quickly compared to the HCl also. I would hypothesize that it has something to do with the water solubility and bio-availability. Might be why it seems stronger. The other alkaloids are apparently pulled out with the limonene and vinegar, they say in the original thread that the acuma extract feels very different than a torch extract. They say that the torch extract is also more white, where the acuma extracts all have that orangish tint.

When I took 600mg of the HCl salt I found it to be kind of disappointing, considering that is the heavy dosage range. I'm not very sensitive to MDMA either though, takes me about 250-300mg of chunky crystal to get a good roll, and I weigh only 160 lbs.

Be sure and get calcium hydroxide whatcha, and not sodium carbonate. Definitely only add 300mL of water per 100g cactus. The cactus being a doughy consistency means no extra water for the freebase to be dissolved in, so it increases the efficiency of the solvent.

When you work with limonene you will never want to work with anything again my house actually smells GOOD when I'm extracting! Not that solvent smell! Where I live in a city, I don't have to worry about neighbors smelling solvents and thinking something is going on either. Just smells like I have an orange grove in my kitchen!

[whatchamacallit]

Oops, yeah SWIM was thinking of sodium carbonate in the DMT extraction. So are the only sources for the fumaric acid and the d-limonene the internet? Can't find those just anywhere, correct?

[kcmoxtractor]

I wouldn't go with fumaric acid, go with vinegar and carbonated water (weak carbonic acid solution) that way it keeps with the food grade aspect. After you do your vinegar salting 3x decant the limonene and evaporate the vinegar to get your acetate. Then pour carbonated water over your limonene, shake, release pressure, repeat x3. I would say that this makes it more efficient also since carbonic acid has a lower pKa than acetic acid you will react with a different group of alkaloids. Let it sit over night then decant the limonene from the carbonated water. My carbonate alkaloids were much lighter in color than my acetate alkaloids...
You can find d-limonene locally in larger areas, it is sold as orange oil. It is a degreaser usually. I paid $40 for a gallon, but it can be distilled and reused.

Since we don't have a sponsor that sells it, I got it from www.greenterpene.com.

[kcmoxtractor]

Third Pull yielded another 2 grams of waxiness.

That brings the total to 5.4g or 2.7%. I have to get some more vinegar and carbonated water then do another salting, I'm gonna pull until I see diminishing yield, 69ron said he got close to 7% from bridgesii.

[Landogarner]

Very nice! Definitely giving this a try. Thanks for posting this!

[-Hg-]

Can anybody tell me if there would be a difference in yield if one were to use either pachanoi or peruviana. Thanks

[bbd2]

Originally Posted by -Hg-

Can anybody tell me if there would be a difference in yield if one were to use either pachanoi or peruviana. Thanks

maybe
maybe not

its a plant, so individuals vary
a particular mutant from either species might be strongest

extraction tek skill is a better predictor of yield than species when dealing with trichs

focus on getting everything from whichever species you are working on

[kcmoxtractor]

You would probably have less alkaloids in the other cacti. Bridgesii are known to have a high alkaloid content.

[kcmoxtractor]

Fourth pull .6g acetate alone, carbonate has not fully evaporated yet. With this acetate weight added it is 6.1g, 3.05%.

[weeeeeee]

nice thread kc

[Fly on the Wall]

Hey KC, how do you evap your vinegar? Have you noticed whether heat-assisted evaporation does anything to potency?

[kcmoxtractor]

I just evaporate with a fan blowing on the surface. I have no idea whether heat would effect potency or what heat the degradation would begin. You could look over at the nexus, the original thread is about 35 pages long and filled with tons of information.

[waylitjim]

Thanks for sharing this.

Archive Material > Mesc Extraction

[waylitjim]

Some words from the creator of this tek...

Originally Posted by 69Ron

I've recently been using mescaline HCl in the 50-75 mg range. At that dose for me it’s mostly just a pleasant stimulant and mood enhancer with aphrodisiac effects. I'm speaking of purified mescaline hydrochloride extracted from San Pedro or Peruvian Torch, and not whole cactus which is a little different.

A 50-75 mg dose is fantastic. One feels slightly energized, content and peaceful, conversation is easy and quite fun to engage in, social interaction feels more meaningful and spontaneous, creativity is slightly increased, and there’s a happy playfulness one feels. It’s easier to feel connected to others. You feel a sense of empathy. Humor comes easily and is quite satisfying. Sex is also improved, and for the man stamina is improved. It’s a great social drug just as long as the dose is kept low. At higher hallucinogenic doses, it is not at all a social drug but more of a spiritual experience.

For me low doses go really well with a strong cup of coffee which brings out some of the psychedelic qualities even at such a low dose. Coffee somewhat increases the psychedelic and euphoric effects of mescaline. It’s a great combination.

I'm a little more sensitive to mescaline than others. So that 50-75 mg range might be a bit too small for some other people. For me mescaline HCl becomes psychedelic at 100 mg. At 200 mg it's a rich psychedelic experience. At 300 mg its is a heavy psychedelic experience.

San Pedro is smoother than pure mescaline, more mellow, not as jolting, but not by much. It’s close enough that some people might have a hard time telling the two apart. Peruvian Torch is extremely close to pure mescaline. I cannot really tell the difference.

Achuma (Bridgesii) is very dreamy and sedating at first and very unlike mescaline until a few hours pass and the dreamy sedating effect starts to give way to a more mescaline like experience. This is the least like pure mescaline of the three. Peyote is even less like pure mescaline. Bridgesii contains alkaloids other than mescaline that makes it more potent. The trip is somewhat unlike a mescaline trip. The other active alkaloids really change the experience. I like it, but it's less like mescaline than San Pedro is. The Torch is the most like mescaline out of all three. Bridgessi doesn't actually contain much mescaline, but the other alkaloids in it enhance the effects a lot. It's believed that one alkaloid in it acts like an MAOI making the mescaline much more powerful.

If looking for a mescaline like experience, I would not recommend Achuma or Peyote and I would recommend San Pedro over Peruvian Torch because Peruvian Torch is unreliable. Sometimes Peruvian Torch is very strong and other times it does nothing at all, while San Pedro pretty much always works.

[kcmoxtractor]

Will be consuming 1.5g of this today, we will see how it goes. I'll post a trip report or something along those lines tomorrow maybe next day, depends on how long it lasts.

[Mushrooms201]

Nice write up, I like the all food grade approach. would this setup also work for dmt?

[kcmoxtractor]

Here's a thread by Phlux-, he used another of 69ron's teks. Check out the dmtnexus wiki for the whole tek.


http://forums.mycotopia.net/botanica...ral-spice.html (Natural Spice)

[bbd2]

Originally Posted by kcmoxtractor

Will be consuming 1.5g of this today, we will see how it goes. I'll post a trip report or something along those lines tomorrow maybe next day, depends on how long it lasts.

how wuz it?

[kcmoxtractor]

Still trying to think of a way to verbalize some of the experience without limiting it, was truly indescribable at parts.

[mate0x]

Glad you brought this information to these boards...I'm excited to try it, having done traditional solvent methods in the past. thanks!