Waylit's Pan cyan Tek

waylitjim · 10-07-05, 11:41

I've been working on a recipe to simplify growing Pan cyans.
They can be difficult at times, with this method you can grow them in 5 easy steps. This recipe was intended for P. cyanescens, but can also be used for cubensis.

1-Measure and prepare your substrate
2-Load substrate into the jars and pressure cook
3-Innoculate with spores, liquid culture, agar wedge or slurry
4-Apply casing layer
5-Fruit your jars

I've been using plastic PP5 containers containers which work great. I can fit 9 into the PC at once, and this recipe will make 9 containers. Each lid has a 1/2 hole drilled in the top with a tyvek patch. I use a hot glue gun to apply the filter patch. Here's a pic of the lid and container.

DSCN0158.JPG DSCN0159.JPG

1- Measure and prepare your substrate

Shred 10 cups of horse manure very finely and soak in water overnite. I like to add a half cup of bleach and hydrated lime to the water. The next day pour thru a collander and squeeze the manure out by hand. Set the manure aside, and remember it will not be pasteurized.

Add 10 cups of vermiculite to a large bowl and stir in 2 cups of brown rice flour. Moisten the vermiculite and brown rice flour to field capacity using regular or distilled water.

Combine the BRF/Verm with the horse manure and mix it up really well. You want to evenly distribute the brown rice flour.

2- Load substrate into the jars and pressure cook
Gently pack down the substrate so there's no big air spaces. As usual, add a nice layer of dry vermiculite on top. Seal the lids and cover with aluminum foil. Sterilize in the pressure cooker for 1 hour.

3- Innoculate with spores, liquid culture, agar wedge or slurry
If you only have spores, you can also use this substrate recipe. Starting with spores will add about 1 week to the colonization time. My agar method goes as follows, shoot 6 ccs of sterile water onto a colonized agar plate. Using the needle tip, mix up the mycelium and water and draw the slurry back into the syringe. No need to dig into the agar layer, just scrape the mycelium off the surface of the agar. Inoculate the containers with 6 cc of mycelium water. They'll be colonized within 15 days and ready to fruit.

4-Apply casing layer
I like to use 50/50 cactus mix and vermiculite. Before mixing in the vermiculite, add hydrated lime and gypsum to the cactus mix, this will help pH balance the casing layer. This casing mix works great for Pans, it has good aeration and is fairly contam resistant. The cactus mix contains forest humus, sphaghnum peat moss, earthworm castings, and sand. I pasteurize the casing mix for 1 hour. After it cools, apply the casing layer 1/4 - 1/2 inch deep. Hydrate the casing layer really well and cover the jars with foil for a few days. Usually 2-3 days is sufficient, this gives the the mycelium a chance to recover. Make sure to poke a few holes in the foil to allow air exchange and prevent cobweb mold.

5- Fruit your jars
Finally! The fun part. Remove the foil from the jars and place them into the fruiting chamber. Only mist the casing if it's dry. Misting the mycelium can delay pinset, and misting pins can cause aborts. Pans will normally start pinning 7-10 days after casing. Just remember to keep the temps warm, the air fresh, and the humidity high. That's it for Waylit's Pan cyan Tek.

Good Luck

~Waylitjim

waylitjim · 10-07-05, 12:49

Here's some Pan Cambos fruiting in containers:

waylitjim · 10-07-05, 12:53

Here's Goliath showing off it's heavy spore load

waylitjim · 10-07-05, 13:22

Here's an isolate of Goliath that's being tested out.
The 3 factors when choosing an isolate were:
Pinset, Size, and Quickness.
These are one day away from harvest.

waylitjim · 10-07-05, 13:30

And the final shots before decapitation

10-07-05, 14:05

Good save Waylit...mine are still a cookin..was gonna rate this thread but there's no rating mushies yet....

red_lenses · 10-11-05, 17:58

Jim when you shoot the jars(spores) do you just innoc.through the hole in 1 point?
or do you angle the needle and innoc. at several points pf style?

waylitjim · 10-11-05, 18:19

I remove the lid and use 3 or 4 inoculation points, with 6 cc's of LC.
The jars are fully colonized in 2 weeks time, and ready for phase II.
If you plan on using spores, I recommend adding a bit more BRF to
the formula. I believe Golly is trying equal parts manure, verm and BRF.

red_lenses · 10-11-05, 18:43

How many cc's of spores would you use?

BennyBlanco · 10-11-05, 19:04

were do u get the containers pp5

10-11-05, 20:11

On my jars/tubs i put a layer of tin foil right under the lid , so to innoculate ijust unscrew the metal lid and shoot right through the foil in 6 places using about half a cc/ml per hole...the foil just helps to reduce the exposure of the substrate...then srew lid back on...the same could be done with a plastic tub and plastic wrap...
In one set of jars there was only 1 innoc point and they are running way behind but should colo soon...5 have been cased and awaiting pinning..
btw "Gladware" is all pp5

rockawayrooms · 10-11-05, 20:27

Very nice indeedy Jim,thanks fer sharing your tek!!

Old_Recordings · 10-11-05, 21:01

Dope additional pictures. Very cool and informative grow log. What's the humidity and air exchange gotta be kept at for the cyans to grow at a steady rate?

waylitjim · 10-11-05, 22:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old_Recordings

Very cool and informative grow log. What's the humidity and air exchange gotta be kept at
for the cyans to grow at a steady rate?

Pans like it a bit warmer then cubs:
Incubation & Spawn run - 79-84°F
Cropping - 75-80° F with relative humidity @ 85-92%
These were kept in a greenhouse which stayed warm and humid with lots of fresh air.
A humidifier was set to run every other hour for one hour. Air exchange was provided with
an air pump and tubing which directs fresh air to the different shelves of the greenhouse.
Optimal air exchange is twice an hour, although I like continuous fresh air.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BennyBlanco

were do u get the containers pp5

Look for any polypropylene containers that have the (PP5) stamp.
They usually have the rating in a triangle on the bottom.

shobimono · 10-11-05, 22:31

You had mentioned that you use a heating pad. What brand? Is it a reptile pad or a seedling pad? or are they the same thing?
Do you place the tubs or anything on this pad? or is it placed at the bottom of your greenhouse?

waylitjim · 10-11-05, 23:29

The heat mat is made by Hydrofarm, they make the best (safest) heat mats on the market.
The thermostat has a temperature control range of 68-95 deg F. Smaller mats are available,
but mine is (48 in. X 20 in.) It's placed on the bottom shelf of the greenhouse, with nothing
sitting directly on top of it. It's recommended to use a thermostat, but if you don't, make sure
you get a quality heat mat...otherwise it could be a fire hazard. The Hydrofarm mats are made
really well, meaning they don't overheat, so you don't really need the thermostat.

SmellMyFingers · 10-12-05, 00:46

Nice...very nice

SporesMan · 10-12-05, 22:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by waylitjim

Here's an isolate of Goliath that's being tested out.
The 3 factors when choosing an isolate were:
Pinset, Size, and Quickness.

Do you think one of these days you can go through a step by step process of this isolation method. It would be nice to see the genetic selection in progress. I would also love to see this TEK in the main TEK page.

waylitjim · 10-13-05, 00:19

The process of strain isolation is the same with all species, whether it's
cubensis or cyanescens, you'll need to find a superior substrain. It's best to
start with just one drop of spore solution on agar and then seperate the
strongest growth to new dishes untill you're down to only one substrain per
dish, then you can fruit each substrain. This process can take a while, but
in the end, you end up with a master culture which can be kept for years.
RR did a nice writeup on this a while back, here's the link.
Mycotopia Web Archive: Strain-Isolation on-Agar.-w/pix

10-13-05, 16:06

RR was saying in a post a while back no
matter how many iso's he did with the pans
he could never get a good substrain....lol
but maybe he just had bad luck...

waylitjim · 10-13-05, 23:48

Sometimes it makes good sense to go multispore,
clone your ideal specimen, and grow it till it
won't grow no more... that could be years.

10-14-05, 07:14

Archive material / non cubie shrooms

711 · 10-14-05, 07:23

What is the potency of Pan cyan compared to cubies. Weaker/Stronger?

waylitjim · 10-14-05, 10:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by 711

What is the potency of Pan cyan compared to cubies. Weaker/Stronger?

Pan cyans, at the very least are 3 times stronger than cubensis. Some say 5 to 6X as strong. Cubensis is one of the largest psilocybes out there, but they're definitely not the strongest. This is one reason exotics are so precious in the myco community. They're very potent!

waylitjim · 10-14-05, 11:29

As an alternative Pan cyan substrate, try sterilizing a mixture of manure,
vermiculite, perlite and ryegrass seed. Inoculate, and let the jars colonize
completely. Fruit from the container or lay this mix out in a small tray and
case with a thin layer. Allow this to recover for 48 hours. The vermiculite
has good water retention, perlite holds some but adds good fluff, and the
ryegrass seed does both. As long as you add some grain or seed to the
manure mix, you can inoculate with spores but it's never a good idea
to pasteurize compost intended for spores, always sterilize first.

10-14-05, 13:41

My tubs were way overdue for pinning [Had always pinned on the 7th day when God is resting lol] So i figured that this maybe one of those shrooms that need a biologically active casing layer to fruit [like Agaricus]...
Sooo i rebirthed em as half cakes and included 10% pasteurized worm poo in the casing layer...Normally i would not want nutrients in this layer but it's the only good source for benificial microbes i have..today is day 2 and fingers crossed..If this works it may then be pos to fruit a brf cake using a similar "active" casing....any thoughts...?

waylitjim · 10-14-05, 13:50

I know the casing mix I use has nutes in it, mostly from the wormcastings,
and cottonseed meal. Overlay is not a problem with Pans, so encouraging the
mycelium to colonize the casing layer has been helpful in my experience.

spore · 10-14-05, 17:23

great info wlj, the mo is on the way from the auction. can't wait to get these started. thanks again

spore....

waylitjim · 10-14-05, 19:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by spore

great info wlj, the mo is on the way from the auction. can't wait to get these started.
thanks again

Thanks for supporting Mycotopia!

waylitjim · 12-12-05, 17:33

The Pan Viets below are fruiting from the same substrate recipe outlined above. Once the containers were colonized, they were dumped into a shallow tray, cased and fruited. This tray is the result of cloning. For those wondering how to increase yields when working with cyans, cloning is indeed the most efficient method. Tissue was removed from the inside of a large stem, transferred to agar, and injected into containers.
~WLJ

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10-11-05, 18:19	#8 (permalink)
waylitjim Grateful Mod Join Date: Sep 1972 Posts: 3,854	I remove the lid and use 3 or 4 inoculation points, with 6 cc's of LC. The jars are fully colonized in 2 weeks time, and ready for phase II. If you plan on using spores, I recommend adding a bit more BRF to the formula. I believe Golly is trying equal parts manure, verm and BRF. __________________ <((( Waylit's Pan cyan Tek ~~~ Waylit's Wood Lover Tek )))>

10-11-05, 20:27	#12 (permalink)
rockawayrooms Hash Pipe Harry Join Date: Dec 1971 Posts: 2,038	Very nice indeedy Jim,thanks fer sharing your tek!! __________________ Any little song that you know, Everything that's small has to grow!!L.Zep

10-11-05, 21:01	#13 (permalink)
Old_Recordings Mycophiliac Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 74	Dope additional pictures. Very cool and informative grow log. What's the humidity and air exchange gotta be kept at for the cyans to grow at a steady rate? __________________ "You are what you eat"

10-13-05, 00:19	#19 (permalink)
waylitjim Grateful Mod Join Date: Sep 1972 Posts: 3,854	The process of strain isolation is the same with all species, whether it's cubensis or cyanescens, you'll need to find a superior substrain. It's best to start with just one drop of spore solution on agar and then seperate the strongest growth to new dishes untill you're down to only one substrain per dish, then you can fruit each substrain. This process can take a while, but in the end, you end up with a master culture which can be kept for years. RR did a nice writeup on this a while back, here's the link. Mycotopia Web Archive: Strain-Isolation on-Agar.-w/pix __________________ <((( Waylit's Pan cyan Tek ~~~ Waylit's Wood Lover Tek )))> Last edited by Hippie3 : 08-15-07 at 14:17.

10-07-05, 14:05	#6 (permalink)
~golly Guest Posts: n/a	Good save Waylit...mine are still a cookin..was gonna rate this thread but there's no rating mushies yet....

10-11-05, 17:58	#7 (permalink)
red_lenses VIP Member Join Date: Feb 1973 Posts: 281	Jim when you shoot the jars(spores) do you just innoc.through the hole in 1 point? or do you angle the needle and innoc. at several points pf style?

10-11-05, 18:43	#9 (permalink)
red_lenses VIP Member Join Date: Feb 1973 Posts: 281	How many cc's of spores would you use?

10-11-05, 19:04	#10 (permalink)
BennyBlanco Mycotopiate Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 390	were do u get the containers pp5

10-11-05, 20:11	#11 (permalink)
~golly Guest Posts: n/a	On my jars/tubs i put a layer of tin foil right under the lid , so to innoculate ijust unscrew the metal lid and shoot right through the foil in 6 places using about half a cc/ml per hole...the foil just helps to reduce the exposure of the substrate...then srew lid back on...the same could be done with a plastic tub and plastic wrap... In one set of jars there was only 1 innoc point and they are running way behind but should colo soon...5 have been cased and awaiting pinning.. btw "Gladware" is all pp5

10-11-05, 22:31	#15 (permalink)
shobimono Chat Admin Join Date: Jan 1973 Posts: 812	You had mentioned that you use a heating pad. What brand? Is it a reptile pad or a seedling pad? or are they the same thing? Do you place the tubs or anything on this pad? or is it placed at the bottom of your greenhouse?

10-12-05, 00:46	#17 (permalink)
SmellMyFingers Mycophiliac Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 7	Nice...very nice

10-13-05, 16:06	#20 (permalink)
~pcsillypj Guest Posts: n/a	RR was saying in a post a while back no matter how many iso's he did with the pans he could never get a good substrain....lol but maybe he just had bad luck...

10-13-05, 23:48	#21 (permalink)
waylitjim Grateful Mod Join Date: Sep 1972 Posts: 3,854	Sometimes it makes good sense to go multispore, clone your ideal specimen, and grow it till it won't grow no more... that could be years. __________________ <((( Waylit's Pan cyan Tek ~~~ Waylit's Wood Lover Tek )))>

10-14-05, 07:14	#22 (permalink)
~dial8 Guest Posts: n/a	Archive material / non cubie shrooms

10-14-05, 07:23	#23 (permalink)
711 Mycophage Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 149	What is the potency of Pan cyan compared to cubies. Weaker/Stronger?

10-14-05, 11:29	#25 (permalink)
waylitjim Grateful Mod Join Date: Sep 1972 Posts: 3,854	As an alternative Pan cyan substrate, try sterilizing a mixture of manure, vermiculite, perlite and ryegrass seed. Inoculate, and let the jars colonize completely. Fruit from the container or lay this mix out in a small tray and case with a thin layer. Allow this to recover for 48 hours. The vermiculite has good water retention, perlite holds some but adds good fluff, and the ryegrass seed does both. As long as you add some grain or seed to the manure mix, you can inoculate with spores but it's never a good idea to pasteurize compost intended for spores, always sterilize first. __________________ <((( Waylit's Pan cyan Tek ~~~ Waylit's Wood Lover Tek )))>

10-14-05, 13:41	#26 (permalink)
~golly Guest Posts: n/a	My tubs were way overdue for pinning [Had always pinned on the 7th day when God is resting lol] So i figured that this maybe one of those shrooms that need a biologically active casing layer to fruit [like Agaricus]... Sooo i rebirthed em as half cakes and included 10% pasteurized worm poo in the casing layer...Normally i would not want nutrients in this layer but it's the only good source for benificial microbes i have..today is day 2 and fingers crossed..If this works it may then be pos to fruit a brf cake using a similar "active" casing....any thoughts...?

10-14-05, 13:50	#27 (permalink)
waylitjim Grateful Mod Join Date: Sep 1972 Posts: 3,854	I know the casing mix I use has nutes in it, mostly from the wormcastings, and cottonseed meal. Overlay is not a problem with Pans, so encouraging the mycelium to colonize the casing layer has been helpful in my experience. __________________ <((( Waylit's Pan cyan Tek ~~~ Waylit's Wood Lover Tek )))>

10-14-05, 17:23	#28 (permalink)
spore Mycophiliac Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 61	great info wlj, the mo is on the way from the auction. can't wait to get these started. thanks again spore....