Finding a good isolate

RedOctober · 09-02-09, 19:18

What are the keys to finding a good isolate from a multi-spore inoculation? I know that the fastest growing colonies are not necessarily the best fruiting. So what traits do you look for, or is there just no way to tell until it actually fruits?

Sideshow · 09-02-09, 20:09

It really is a crap shoot until the isolate fruits. While it is true that the most vigorously expanding myc does not nec. lead to the best flush, there's not a whole lot to judge by, imo. I try to pick the healthiest looking, most rhizo, & fastest growing myc that I can grab from an agar plate. Long story short, for me cloning is a quicker option with more reliable results. You can potentially get better yeilds by isolating a great strain from multispore, tho.

BuckarooBanzai · 09-02-09, 20:10

The traits you are looking for are fast running, good fruiting and good potency.

Not only can't you tell until you fruit, you also need to eat 'em!

RedOctober · 09-04-09, 20:18

I was afraid you'd say that.

Hippie3 · 09-04-09, 20:39

but in general you want thick ropey threads of mycelia to start off.

BuckarooBanzai · 09-04-09, 23:10

Isolating can be a daunting task, but it is absolutely worth it. Just like cloning, nailing down an isolate can make a big difference in speed and total harvest.

ishkaboo · 09-04-09, 23:41

As far as cloning an isolate from a MS flush goes, I always pick the mushroom that is the thickest/biggest/tallest and fastest to mature and then drop it in an LC. Even after the LC you should isolate again with the flush in order to refine your sub-strain.

On the contrary, I have read that allowing mycelium to pin on agar and picking the first pin to use as an isolate is a good way to go... is there any merit to this since the pin wasn't able to show its full potential with an adequate nutrient supply?

BuckarooBanzai · 09-04-09, 23:57

When you isolate, one of the traits you are looking for is easy and prolific fruiting.

A sample that pins on an agar plate is clearly easy to fruit!

ishkaboo · 09-05-09, 00:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by BuckarooBanzai

When you isolate, one of the traits you are looking for is easy and prolific fruiting.

A sample that pins on an agar plate is clearly easy to fruit!

Good point.

So would you say using the first pin from agar is the best way to isolate, or is picking the "ideal" mushroom from a MS flush and refining it better?

BuckarooBanzai · 09-05-09, 00:27

Well, you know the pin on agar is a good fruiter.

A good cluster from a MS flush is going to be fast, a good fruiter and strong against contams - more known traits that you want.

Given a choice, I would start with clone tissue from a good cluster.

ishkaboo · 09-05-09, 01:02

Good input. I would give rep but it wont let me.

BuckarooBanzai · 09-05-09, 01:15

Ya gotta spread the rep around to give more to the same person.

It makes folks feel good and it helps keep the vocally opinionated (like myself) from getting too impressed with themselves...

ishkaboo · 09-05-09, 01:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by BuckarooBanzai

Ya gotta spread the rep around to give more to the same person.

It makes folks feel good and it helps keep the vocally opinionated (like myself) from getting too impressed with themselves...

Oh, I spread it, believe me; but maybe too much? Who knows. Props to you though bro.

SisterMagpie · 09-05-09, 05:27

If you pick the isolate that pins on agar doesn't that just means it is a prolific pinner. It could be like 50% aborts when you fruit. I thought it would still be necessary to fruit. Not that strong pinning is a bad quality.

MLBjammer · 09-05-09, 06:28

It's still something of a crapshoot, regardless of what tissue you clone. But if mycelium is pinning on agar, that is a damn good sign. Aborts, although partly caused by genetics, are also caused by environmental factors. It is all about experimenting, though. Peace.

Hippie3 · 09-05-09, 09:09

plus it's simple and fast to just pin on agar
again as a preliminary test
on the road to the best isolate.
if it pins better than rival choices,
take the next step and whip up a batch.

SisterMagpie · 09-05-09, 09:45

Hope my foaf's agar gets some pins... even though it's from a MS

BuckarooBanzai · 09-05-09, 09:47

It is kind of weird, after you progress far enough in this hobby to start experimenting with isolates and agar...you find yourself right back at the beginning playing with cakes and mini-bulks again because you need to fruit 10 different sub-strains at once...

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09-02-09, 19:18	#1 (permalink)
RedOctober Mycophage Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 193	Finding a good isolate What are the keys to finding a good isolate from a multi-spore inoculation? I know that the fastest growing colonies are not necessarily the best fruiting. So what traits do you look for, or is there just no way to tell until it actually fruits?

09-02-09, 20:09	#2 (permalink)
Sideshow Freakishly Large Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 353	It really is a crap shoot until the isolate fruits. While it is true that the most vigorously expanding myc does not nec. lead to the best flush, there's not a whole lot to judge by, imo. I try to pick the healthiest looking, most rhizo, & fastest growing myc that I can grab from an agar plate. Long story short, for me cloning is a quicker option with more reliable results. You can potentially get better yeilds by isolating a great strain from multispore, tho. __________________ Thank you, Mr. Mason

09-02-09, 20:10	#3 (permalink)
BuckarooBanzai Prone to ranting... Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 6,050	The traits you are looking for are fast running, good fruiting and good potency. Not only can't you tell until you fruit, you also need to eat 'em! __________________ Banzai Institute for Higher Education (a collection of growing Teks & threads)

09-04-09, 20:39	#5 (permalink)
Hippie3 DUNG DEALER Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 43,266	but in general you want thick ropey threads of mycelia to start off. __________________ visit dial-a-hippie .

09-04-09, 20:18	#4 (permalink)
RedOctober Mycophage Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 193	I was afraid you'd say that.

09-04-09, 23:10	#6 (permalink)
BuckarooBanzai Prone to ranting... Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 6,050	Isolating can be a daunting task, but it is absolutely worth it. Just like cloning, nailing down an isolate can make a big difference in speed and total harvest. __________________ Banzai Institute for Higher Education (a collection of growing Teks & threads)

09-04-09, 23:41	#7 (permalink)
ishkaboo Mycophage Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 813	As far as cloning an isolate from a MS flush goes, I always pick the mushroom that is the thickest/biggest/tallest and fastest to mature and then drop it in an LC. Even after the LC you should isolate again with the flush in order to refine your sub-strain. On the contrary, I have read that allowing mycelium to pin on agar and picking the first pin to use as an isolate is a good way to go... is there any merit to this since the pin wasn't able to show its full potential with an adequate nutrient supply? __________________ "Go then. There are other worlds than these"

09-04-09, 23:57	#8 (permalink)
BuckarooBanzai Prone to ranting... Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 6,050	When you isolate, one of the traits you are looking for is easy and prolific fruiting. A sample that pins on an agar plate is clearly easy to fruit! __________________ Banzai Institute for Higher Education (a collection of growing Teks & threads)

09-05-09, 00:27	#10 (permalink)
BuckarooBanzai Prone to ranting... Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 6,050	Well, you know the pin on agar is a good fruiter. A good cluster from a MS flush is going to be fast, a good fruiter and strong against contams - more known traits that you want. Given a choice, I would start with clone tissue from a good cluster. __________________ Banzai Institute for Higher Education (a collection of growing Teks & threads)

09-05-09, 01:02	#11 (permalink)
ishkaboo Mycophage Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 813	Good input. I would give rep but it wont let me. __________________ "Go then. There are other worlds than these"

09-05-09, 01:15	#12 (permalink)
BuckarooBanzai Prone to ranting... Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 6,050	Ya gotta spread the rep around to give more to the same person. It makes folks feel good and it helps keep the vocally opinionated (like myself) from getting too impressed with themselves... __________________ Banzai Institute for Higher Education (a collection of growing Teks & threads)

09-05-09, 05:27	#14 (permalink)
SisterMagpie VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 106	If you pick the isolate that pins on agar doesn't that just means it is a prolific pinner. It could be like 50% aborts when you fruit. I thought it would still be necessary to fruit. Not that strong pinning is a bad quality. __________________ This is Lucy. Lucy, is an artist. Lucy paints pictures of Barbara Streisand.

09-05-09, 06:28	#15 (permalink)
MLBjammer Addicted to Invitro Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,864	It's still something of a crapshoot, regardless of what tissue you clone. But if mycelium is pinning on agar, that is a damn good sign. Aborts, although partly caused by genetics, are also caused by environmental factors. It is all about experimenting, though. Peace.

09-05-09, 09:09	#16 (permalink)
Hippie3 DUNG DEALER Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 43,266	plus it's simple and fast to just pin on agar again as a preliminary test on the road to the best isolate. if it pins better than rival choices, take the next step and whip up a batch. __________________ visit dial-a-hippie .

09-05-09, 09:45	#17 (permalink)
SisterMagpie VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 106	Hope my foaf's agar gets some pins... even though it's from a MS __________________ This is Lucy. Lucy, is an artist. Lucy paints pictures of Barbara Streisand.

09-05-09, 09:47	#18 (permalink)
BuckarooBanzai Prone to ranting... Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 6,050	It is kind of weird, after you progress far enough in this hobby to start experimenting with isolates and agar...you find yourself right back at the beginning playing with cakes and mini-bulks again because you need to fruit 10 different sub-strains at once... __________________ Banzai Institute for Higher Education (a collection of growing Teks & threads)

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