Trying grain spawn for the first time

Faaip De Oaid · 10-27-09, 16:36

Right now I am starting my first attempt at grain spawning. I have popcorn PCing at 15 psi and it has been almost an hour. I am following Irishlions write up, on this. I have two quart jars with a 1/2 cup of verm in each, and I'm going to load each jar about 2/3 full and PC again for another hour. I havent decided if I'm going to use a liquid culture of Treasure Coast that my buddy gave me, or a spore syringe of TC. I may do one of each. After straining the popcorn after PCing, i rinsed the corn with cold water to rinse off the starch, right now they are drying. After I PC the jars with the grain I'm gonna let them cool and then incoulate them and let them incubate and shake and all that good stuff.

Now to spawning.

What I am planning on doing, and I am open to suggestions (hint, hint, this is where all you experienced ones come in), is preparing some rye grains. I am planning on PCing some rye berries at 15 psi for an hour, then once the berries dry, put them into an oven-safe turkey baking bag. I haven't decided if I'm going to PC the bag with the berries in it, or bake the berry bag in the oven, like I said I'm open to suggestions. Once I have a sterile berry bag, I plan on putting the bag in my glove box, and add a peroxide solution to the berries. Im going to wait a half hour or so then transfer the pre-inoculating popcorn into the bags of rye.

Hows that sound? I've been researching this for a few weeks and haven't found a good tek for transferring popcorn to other grains.

Any feedback is greatly appreciated. Thanks

hyphaenation · 10-27-09, 16:38

Did you you read this set of threads ?

http://forums.mycotopia.net/popcorn-teks/

Best of luck.

copelandiaKidd · 10-27-09, 16:39

Best of luck on this grow to ya!!!!!!!!

BuckarooBanzai · 10-27-09, 17:20

I don't understand your post.

Colonized popcorn makes good spawn.

Faaip De Oaid · 10-27-09, 17:44

but popcorn is not a good substrate for fruiting so I've read. so I want to fruit with they rye

larshroom · 10-27-09, 18:15

Rye is not a substrate. It is used to spawn, like popcorn.

Coir/verm would be a substrate or worm castings/coir/verm, etc...

I also inoculated popcorn for the first time just today, I was using rye grain but ran out so I am trying something new.

I think you used to much verm in your jar. I used between 1/8 and 1/4 cup of verm per qt. jar

I have found so far I like popcorn better. No rinsing, soaking, it doesnt fall through the colandar and it smells better.

hyphaenation · 10-27-09, 18:23

Quote:

I have found so far I like Popcorn better. No rinsing, soaking,

Which tek did you use that involves no soaking or rinsing ?

larshroom · 10-27-09, 18:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by hyphaenation

Which tek did you use that involves no soaking or rinsing ?

This one courtesy of IrishLion

http://forums.mycotopia.net/fungi-gr...yfil-lids.html (Popcorn Simple and easy with single hole polyfil Lids)

hyphaenation · 10-27-09, 18:27

Says page not found , but thanks for the link anyways. I know which one your referring to now.

larshroom · 10-27-09, 18:34

This one should work just in case...

http://forums.mycotopia.net/fungi-gr...yfil-lids.html (Popcorn Simple and easy with single hole polyfil Lids)

Faaip De Oaid · 10-27-09, 21:31

so are you saying that fungi won't fruit on rye?

BuckarooBanzai · 10-28-09, 08:43

Psilocybians will fruit from any grain - but not very well.

Mushrooms are 90% water. Grain doesn't hold very much water, thus straight grain doesn't fruit very well.

Popcorn and rye can both be used to fruit from, but grain will fruit much better if it is surrounded by a substrate that holds lots of water. This is sometimes called the "rez effect" (or reservoir effect).

Popcorn and coir will fruit much better than straight popcorn. If you add a little poo to the mix, it will fruit even better.

eatyualive · 10-28-09, 11:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faaip De Oaid

but popcorn is not a good substrate for fruiting so I've read. so I want to fruit with they rye

i don't see much difference in yield in bulk subs using popcorn grain vs wbs grain. its about the same to me. wbs does colonize bulk subs faster with more inoculation points.

also im not comparing fruiting directly off the grain. just the grain with bulk substrates.

Sidestreet Getaway · 10-28-09, 14:37

Hey bud!

Popcorn and other grains are best used by mixing them with things like straw, poo, coir, and vermiculite. It actually doesn't make much sense to spawn a grain to another grain.

Start with one of those coir blocks you got; it's super easy. Once your popcorn is colonized, stick the whole coir brick in a bucket or big pot and dump some boiling water on it. The whole block will expand into a earthy, wet substance.

Make sure your expanded coir is at field capacity by squeezing by hand. Only a drop or two of water should come out. Then mix in your popcorn and you're good to go!

EDIT: Make sure it cools before you go grabbing it or mixing your spawn into it!

I like to use a trash bag in the bottom of my monotub. Mix your popcorn and coir right in the bag and make the surface level. Wait one week (it should all colonize, fluffy and white) and then cut the trashbag off just above the surface level. Stuff your holes with polyfill.

Good luck! Feel free to pm me.

P4ulada · 10-28-09, 15:29

Yeah man, cut the sides of the trashbag is a good ideia, I didn´t think on it before =/
But no worries, next harvest I take a little more time to do it huhuhu
Thanks SG!

Good luck FDO, a monotub for the first time sounds very evolutive

Faaip De Oaid · 10-29-09, 01:02

I saw a bag of cow poo at the hohme dee-poe, would that work to mix with the coir as a substrate (after pasteurization of course)?

Faaip De Oaid · 10-29-09, 01:03

o and thanks for all the input you guys, its been extremely helpful!!

BuckarooBanzai · 10-29-09, 01:05

I have seen people get good results with bagged poo. I've also seen people get poor results with bagged poo.

If you Pasteurize it right and don't get things too wet, you will probably be good. I would go with 50% coir to keep things nice and fluffy. A muddy consistency is always a bad thing in a bulk substrate.

Faaip De Oaid · 10-29-09, 01:22

I was thinking 50/25/25 coir/verm/poo or just 50/50 coir/verm.

and i just inoculated 3 quarts, 2 with TC LC and 1 with the TC syringe. then i rewarded myself with some bongloads.

Pray for me!

BuckarooBanzai · 10-29-09, 01:25

Clean growth vibes coming your way!

50:50 coir:verm will work as a substrate, but you'll get better results with a little poo thrown in.

Straight coir will work as well.

Faaip De Oaid · 10-29-09, 01:42

can i pasteurize the poo and coir together?

from what I've read, the verm wouldn't need to be pasteurized, just brought to field capacity and mixed in after, yes?

MLBjammer · 10-29-09, 06:06

Personally I have found the bagged cow manure to be very disappointing--but that is just my experience. I would urge you to find some horse poo, worm castings, some field cow poo, or order some dung from Mycrotopia (you cannot go wrong there!). But, as BB said, some have reported great success with the bagged c-poo.

I would pasteurize everything together--it just makes your process simpler. Just make sure the substrate is at field capacity before you spawn.

Good vibes your way, man.

MushroomJoe · 10-29-09, 06:33

Just to add my .02$.....

I have had fruit from a straight popcorn substrate before. I was in a crunch and laid 2 quart jars worth of popcorn in a cleaned out tortilla tray like you get at chili's let it recolonize in the incubator for a week or so. Then I double end cased as you would a BRF cake, and I got 3 or 4 decent flushes with about 6-10 mushies each, and let me tell you, some of them were straight up huge. (Probably due to all of the extra water that the substrate was gaining from the large casing surface area in comparison with the few actual fruit that were popping up.)

ThirdEyePriedWide · 10-29-09, 07:04

i also seem to remember a tek or two that used only popcorn and verm... sort of a corn rez effect. have to case though from what i remember. exposed corn = contam. i was going to try it, but my fractional sterilization failed and all became yard waste. so if you really wanna go corn only, or are limited on resources...

good luck!

Sidestreet Getaway · 10-29-09, 11:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faaip De Oaid

can i pasteurize the poo and coir together?

from what I've read, the verm wouldn't need to be pasteurized, just brought to field capacity and mixed in after, yes?

You can pasteurize anything together, provided that after you pasteurize, you let it cool and make sure you're at field capacity afterward.

If your verm is coming from a freshly opened bag you can use it without pasteurizing. Otherwise I would probably bake it in the oven and just sterilize it, high temp for a half hour or so.

Faaip De Oaid · 10-30-09, 00:28

spotted some myc in one of my lc jars! less than 24 hours!

eatyualive · 10-30-09, 11:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by BuckarooBanzai

I have seen people get good results with bagged poo. I've also seen people get poor results with bagged poo.

If you Pasteurize it right and don't get things too wet, you will probably be good. I would go with 50% coir to keep things nice and fluffy. A muddy consistency is always a bad thing in a bulk substrate.

i agree results are mixed. ive also used black cow poo for a good 20 runs or so with mixed results. some were awesome. some not so awesome. but i was also using straw/black cow manure 50/50 ratio. so the straw probably made up where the black cow didn't.

sometime its really just dirt and wood chips. its really hard to have consistent results using the cheap stuff locally because it depends on your locality. some places might have some nice real cow poo. others might just be dirt lol..

Sidestreet Getaway · 10-30-09, 12:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faaip De Oaid

spotted some myc in one of my lc jars! less than 24 hours!

Your popcorn??? Freakin' sweet, man! It's on, now.

Faaip De Oaid · 10-30-09, 15:19

both quarts of lc are showing growth all over!
i'll post a couple pics later

BuckarooBanzai · 10-30-09, 20:58

One of my favorite things about popcorn is the speed.

Ya can argue a lot of things about grain (easiest, cheapest, most nutritious, etc.) but you can't argue which one is faster. Popcorn wins that race hands down.

Faaip De Oaid · 11-01-09, 17:02

right now i have a friend thats going to hook me up with some horse poo, i guess its pretty "dry", but not like she's dried to or anything. would this be good to mix into the substrate, or should I just play it safe and order some dry horse poo from Mycrotopia

Sidestreet Getaway · 11-01-09, 17:37

Good poo will have some structure to it, dry is fine. You don't want to start out with a big wet bucket of shit... it should be aged and smell earthy, not shitty.

At the same time I once got some REALLY old stuff that was just like fine black dirt. It didn't do too well. I think it was too old/composted.

I say give it a shot, if it works great, if not definitely order some from mycrotopia.

Mushxmagik · 11-15-09, 23:22

pullin up a chair for this.... good luck bro!

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10-27-09, 16:36	#1 (permalink)
Faaip De Oaid Rotten Apple Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 96	Trying grain spawn for the first time Right now I am starting my first attempt at grain spawning. I have popcorn PCing at 15 psi and it has been almost an hour. I am following Irishlions write up, on this. I have two quart jars with a 1/2 cup of verm in each, and I'm going to load each jar about 2/3 full and PC again for another hour. I havent decided if I'm going to use a liquid culture of Treasure Coast that my buddy gave me, or a spore syringe of TC. I may do one of each. After straining the popcorn after PCing, i rinsed the corn with cold water to rinse off the starch, right now they are drying. After I PC the jars with the grain I'm gonna let them cool and then incoulate them and let them incubate and shake and all that good stuff. Now to spawning. What I am planning on doing, and I am open to suggestions (hint, hint, this is where all you experienced ones come in), is preparing some rye grains. I am planning on PCing some rye berries at 15 psi for an hour, then once the berries dry, put them into an oven-safe turkey baking bag. I haven't decided if I'm going to PC the bag with the berries in it, or bake the berry bag in the oven, like I said I'm open to suggestions. Once I have a sterile berry bag, I plan on putting the bag in my glove box, and add a peroxide solution to the berries. Im going to wait a half hour or so then transfer the pre-inoculating popcorn into the bags of rye. Hows that sound? I've been researching this for a few weeks and haven't found a good tek for transferring popcorn to other grains. Any feedback is greatly appreciated. Thanks

10-27-09, 16:38	#2 (permalink)
hyphaenation Puck Teknician Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 5,646	Did you you read this set of threads ? http://forums.mycotopia.net/popcorn-teks/ Best of luck. __________________ We're just flying by the seed of our plants.

10-27-09, 16:39	#3 (permalink)
copelandiaKidd Void Of Boundaries Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 578	Best of luck on this grow to ya!!!!!!!! __________________ "LEARN THE RULES SO YOU CAN BREAK THEM PROPERLY" -The Dali lama "i don't care if it eats my cat, as long as the damn thing fruits"~ prism

10-27-09, 17:20	#4 (permalink)
BuckarooBanzai Prone to ranting... Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 6,050	I don't understand your post. Colonized popcorn makes good spawn. __________________ Banzai Institute for Higher Education (a collection of growing Teks & threads)

10-27-09, 17:44	#5 (permalink)
Faaip De Oaid Rotten Apple Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 96	but popcorn is not a good substrate for fruiting so I've read. so I want to fruit with they rye

10-27-09, 18:15	#6 (permalink)
larshroom Mycophiliac Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 159	Rye is not a substrate. It is used to spawn, like popcorn. Coir/verm would be a substrate or worm castings/coir/verm, etc... I also inoculated popcorn for the first time just today, I was using rye grain but ran out so I am trying something new. I think you used to much verm in your jar. I used between 1/8 and 1/4 cup of verm per qt. jar I have found so far I like popcorn better. No rinsing, soaking, it doesnt fall through the colandar and it smells better.

10-27-09, 18:27	#9 (permalink)
hyphaenation Puck Teknician Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 5,646	Says page not found , but thanks for the link anyways. I know which one your referring to now. __________________ We're just flying by the seed of our plants.

10-27-09, 18:34	#10 (permalink)
larshroom Mycophiliac Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 159	This one should work just in case... http://forums.mycotopia.net/fungi-gr...yfil-lids.html (Popcorn Simple and easy with single hole polyfil Lids)

10-27-09, 21:31	#11 (permalink)
Faaip De Oaid Rotten Apple Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 96	so are you saying that fungi won't fruit on rye?

10-28-09, 08:43	#12 (permalink)
BuckarooBanzai Prone to ranting... Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 6,050	Psilocybians will fruit from any grain - but not very well. Mushrooms are 90% water. Grain doesn't hold very much water, thus straight grain doesn't fruit very well. Popcorn and rye can both be used to fruit from, but grain will fruit much better if it is surrounded by a substrate that holds lots of water. This is sometimes called the "rez effect" (or reservoir effect). Popcorn and coir will fruit much better than straight popcorn. If you add a little poo to the mix, it will fruit even better. __________________ Banzai Institute for Higher Education (a collection of growing Teks & threads)

10-28-09, 14:37	#14 (permalink)
Sidestreet Getaway Slaptastician Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 1,319	Hey bud! Popcorn and other grains are best used by mixing them with things like straw, poo, coir, and vermiculite. It actually doesn't make much sense to spawn a grain to another grain. Start with one of those coir blocks you got; it's super easy. Once your popcorn is colonized, stick the whole coir brick in a bucket or big pot and dump some boiling water on it. The whole block will expand into a earthy, wet substance. Make sure your expanded coir is at field capacity by squeezing by hand. Only a drop or two of water should come out. Then mix in your popcorn and you're good to go! EDIT: Make sure it cools before you go grabbing it or mixing your spawn into it! I like to use a trash bag in the bottom of my monotub. Mix your popcorn and coir right in the bag and make the surface level. Wait one week (it should all colonize, fluffy and white) and then cut the trashbag off just above the surface level. Stuff your holes with polyfill. Good luck! Feel free to pm me.

10-28-09, 15:29	#15 (permalink)
P4ulada Mycotopiate Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 696	Yeah man, cut the sides of the trashbag is a good ideia, I didn´t think on it before =/ But no worries, next harvest I take a little more time to do it huhuhu Thanks SG! Good luck FDO, a monotub for the first time sounds very evolutive __________________ *I don´t know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everybody.*

10-29-09, 01:02	#16 (permalink)
Faaip De Oaid Rotten Apple Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 96	I saw a bag of cow poo at the hohme dee-poe, would that work to mix with the coir as a substrate (after pasteurization of course)?

10-29-09, 01:03	#17 (permalink)
Faaip De Oaid Rotten Apple Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 96	o and thanks for all the input you guys, its been extremely helpful!!

10-29-09, 01:05	#18 (permalink)
BuckarooBanzai Prone to ranting... Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 6,050	I have seen people get good results with bagged poo. I've also seen people get poor results with bagged poo. If you Pasteurize it right and don't get things too wet, you will probably be good. I would go with 50% coir to keep things nice and fluffy. A muddy consistency is always a bad thing in a bulk substrate. __________________ Banzai Institute for Higher Education (a collection of growing Teks & threads)

10-29-09, 01:22	#19 (permalink)
Faaip De Oaid Rotten Apple Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 96	I was thinking 50/25/25 coir/verm/poo or just 50/50 coir/verm. and i just inoculated 3 quarts, 2 with TC LC and 1 with the TC syringe. then i rewarded myself with some bongloads. Pray for me!

10-29-09, 01:25	#20 (permalink)
BuckarooBanzai Prone to ranting... Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 6,050	Clean growth vibes coming your way! 50:50 coir:verm will work as a substrate, but you'll get better results with a little poo thrown in. Straight coir will work as well. __________________ Banzai Institute for Higher Education (a collection of growing Teks & threads)

10-29-09, 01:42	#21 (permalink)
Faaip De Oaid Rotten Apple Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 96	can i pasteurize the poo and coir together? from what I've read, the verm wouldn't need to be pasteurized, just brought to field capacity and mixed in after, yes?

10-29-09, 06:06	#22 (permalink)
MLBjammer Addicted to Invitro Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,864	Personally I have found the bagged cow manure to be very disappointing--but that is just my experience. I would urge you to find some horse poo, worm castings, some field cow poo, or order some dung from Mycrotopia (you cannot go wrong there!). But, as BB said, some have reported great success with the bagged c-poo. I would pasteurize everything together--it just makes your process simpler. Just make sure the substrate is at field capacity before you spawn. Good vibes your way, man.

10-29-09, 06:33	#23 (permalink)
MushroomJoe Mycotechnician Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 235	Just to add my .02$..... I have had fruit from a straight popcorn substrate before. I was in a crunch and laid 2 quart jars worth of popcorn in a cleaned out tortilla tray like you get at chili's let it recolonize in the incubator for a week or so. Then I double end cased as you would a BRF cake, and I got 3 or 4 decent flushes with about 6-10 mushies each, and let me tell you, some of them were straight up huge. (Probably due to all of the extra water that the substrate was gaining from the large casing surface area in comparison with the few actual fruit that were popping up.) __________________ "We are a way for the Universe to know itself, we are starstuff contemplating the stars." - Carl Sagan ~Temet Nosce~

10-29-09, 07:04	#24 (permalink)
ThirdEyePriedWide Sirius Psychonaut Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 96	i also seem to remember a tek or two that used only popcorn and verm... sort of a corn rez effect. have to case though from what i remember. exposed corn = contam. i was going to try it, but my fractional sterilization failed and all became yard waste. so if you really wanna go corn only, or are limited on resources... good luck! __________________ Animals are something invented by plants to move seeds around. An extremely yang solution to a peculiar problem which they faced. -T.McKenna

10-30-09, 00:28	#26 (permalink)
Faaip De Oaid Rotten Apple Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 96	spotted some myc in one of my lc jars! less than 24 hours!

10-30-09, 15:19	#29 (permalink)
Faaip De Oaid Rotten Apple Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 96	both quarts of lc are showing growth all over! i'll post a couple pics later

10-30-09, 20:58	#30 (permalink)
BuckarooBanzai Prone to ranting... Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 6,050	One of my favorite things about popcorn is the speed. Ya can argue a lot of things about grain (easiest, cheapest, most nutritious, etc.) but you can't argue which one is faster. Popcorn wins that race hands down. __________________ Banzai Institute for Higher Education (a collection of growing Teks & threads)

11-01-09, 17:02	#31 (permalink)
Faaip De Oaid Rotten Apple Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 96	right now i have a friend thats going to hook me up with some horse poo, i guess its pretty "dry", but not like she's dried to or anything. would this be good to mix into the substrate, or should I just play it safe and order some dry horse poo from Mycrotopia

11-01-09, 17:37	#32 (permalink)
Sidestreet Getaway Slaptastician Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 1,319	Good poo will have some structure to it, dry is fine. You don't want to start out with a big wet bucket of shit... it should be aged and smell earthy, not shitty. At the same time I once got some REALLY old stuff that was just like fine black dirt. It didn't do too well. I think it was too old/composted. I say give it a shot, if it works great, if not definitely order some from mycrotopia.

11-15-09, 23:22	#33 (permalink)
Mushxmagik Boomtastic! Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 132	pullin up a chair for this.... good luck bro! __________________ Shrooms are awesome for getting back in touch with your root. LSD is for reaching out with your branches.

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