Superbud growlog/When to initiate flowering..?

golly · 02-12-08, 17:47

Hey, i want to grow one of these two under a single 250W bulb..
They're 60% sativa at almost 5 weeks ..
So how much will these continue to stretch once switched to 12/12...?
The taller one is about 15inches..
I don't want it to outgrow the light and may SCROG it..

The other plant which i hope is male will go to the GH..They are ready to be
re-potted and have been pinched once...
Got any hints for a noob..Thnx

procell · 02-12-08, 17:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by golly

Hey, i want to grow one of these two under a single 250W bulb..
They're 60% sativa at almost 5 weeks ..
So how much will these continue to stretch once switched to 12/12...?

How big is the grow box?

It depends on how much harvest you want and how long you want to grow.

Me, I'd pinch the top of every branch and veg more

Foster · 02-12-08, 17:54

FME most will at least double their size after initiating 12/12. Some Indicas may not, but most indica/sativa hybrids seem to. I'd go ahead and re-pot, give it a week or 2 to recover, and flower soon after to keep the best penetration available with your 250. Or do some bending, training. . Looks good so far Golly! Foster

massive042 · 02-12-08, 18:26

If it were me and those were the conditions I had, I would
tie it from the top and bend until horizontal. Essentially
you are making every node point a cola. With a sativa mix
especially that baby will stretch!!! At least double
probably triple when flowered. IMHO bending and
training is your best option for maximized yield. gl!!

Hash_Man · 02-12-08, 19:21

For a 250 watt bulb you probably want to bloom it right away, scrog is a very good idea. Is your 250 hps or MH? and is that what the plant are under right now? If it is MH it will stretch less, (keep your day/night temps within 5 degrees if possible and/or try Mr. Nodes, I use Bushmaster, they are a growth inhibitor made from kelp and you might not get any noticeable stretch at all. I only speak for Bushmaster but Mr. Nodes or others maybe similar, I spray with nitrozine 2-3 days before the switch then water with 5ml per gallon of Bushmaster @ bloom then Nitrozine 2-3 days after switch. You can use any good strong kelp product instead of Nitrozime,
or Bushmaster alone at 7.5 -10 ml and flush 3-6 days after, then fert. as usual.

note: 1/2 strength or less of bloom fert. @ switch

Edit: also, those look like clones but if from seed and being heavier sativa. you would need more age on then IMO.

procell · 02-12-08, 19:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hash_Man

I use Bushmaster, they are a growth inhibitor made from kelp and you might not get any noticeable stretch at all.

Wellllllllllll, you can try all of that fancy stuff and I trust your recommendations that it does give great results but if your wanting to inhibit growth just pinch the tops, slows the plant right down. Au Natural, fast, quick, cheap, bushy.

alounacara · 02-12-08, 20:08

Golly those look mostly Indica to me which is a good thing because my Sativas stretched about 2.5 ft when i cut the light back
I didnt pinch or cut back but i wanted natural colas for some reason with my grow...
Are you shure those are 60% Sativas?

golly · 02-12-08, 20:38

Thanx for the comments..These are seed grown "monster bud" heh ..supposed to be 60/40 ..They do have an Indica look to 'em though..
The light is Ceramic metal halide ,which i'm experimening with ..I do have a HPS backup.
Seedlings were started under CFL 125W untill last week..

I do like the idea of tying the tops to a grid for better exposure [scrog]

So i think i'll repot and wait another week to decide ..I plan to use a wide mouth
4-5 gallon tub with promix/perlite...

Do u think the tall skinny one is likely a male..?

CoyoteMesc · 02-12-08, 21:25

Beautiful plants golly. My suggestion is this.
If you were gonna let em grow vertical I would go ahead and put em in flower. Since your wanting to scrog em you will need some training. With training I would veg and train until you have all the desired sites through the screen.
As you know strain, nutes, level of darkness all contribute to stretch. I would suggest zero N with a bloom fert. Complete darkness (so dark you cant see your hand 2 inches in front of your face).

Im still learning so much. But wanted to give my 2 cents.

Edit to say* impossible to tell sex from those pics.

BlacHaze · 02-12-08, 21:35

I think the extra veg time will get you extra bud. I'm in week 5 of veg and will go at least 8. I agree with Massive that you should bend the tall one over. I would open up the shorter plant to allow more light to the interior. You want the interior branches to grow out instead of the top going up. If you planted both from natural seed (not feminized) then I think the tall one will be a male and the short one will be female. And I would use the HPS when you switch to flower. Even better, get a second ballast and use both lights for full spectrum and more lumens. Hard to tell those plants are from a noob, good luck.

And since they are a good looking couple, you may want to pollinate a section of your female.
If you get any females.

alounacara · 02-12-08, 21:42

Ceramic lights are for parking lots but thats ok if you are still vegging your plants
The tall one is most likely a male plant but dont bet on it
Your plants look mostly Indica to me so dont worry so much about a huge stretch unless your grow area is only 5` high
Your plants look good so far

golly · 02-12-08, 22:31

Yeah, i was hoping to pollinate a branch for next time..
I guess my problem is, not knowing which is the Fem ..I don't have room to scrog train them both under this light..
Guess the only other choice is to go 12/12 to sex 'em then revert back to vedge..?

Gotta say i'm pretty stoked bout these gurls ..I do grow some tropical plants but it's nothing like this deal here..Have to thank y'all for being such a bad influence

and inspiring this grow...

procell · 02-12-08, 23:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by golly

Yeah, i was hoping to pollinate a branch for next time..
I guess my problem is, not knowing which is the Fem ..I don't have room to scrog train them both under this light..
Guess the only other choice is to go 12/12 to sex 'em then revert back to vedge..?

If you've got room take a clone or two and force them and pinch the plants to slow them down

alounacara · 02-12-08, 23:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by golly

Yeah, i was hoping to pollinate a branch for next time..
I guess my problem is, not knowing which is the Fem

Do you plan on sexing before cloning?

massive042 · 02-12-08, 23:10

Yes, really the only way to know 100% on the
sex is to flower and revert. Or take clones and
flower(will take longer). After awhile you will be
able to tell before flowering(or at least a good
hunch), but do it anyway to be sure. They look
nice and healthy. Also with a second look those
do exhibit quite indica like qualities. Dark green,
broad leaves. Keep us posted, interested to see
which direction you go. Oh it makes me long for my
garden... Good thing I have two homeboxes in the mail!!

Foster · 02-12-08, 23:12

Another idea to determine sex would be to take a cutting or two from each. Label accordingly, and give the cutting a minimum of 12 hrs darkness per day. You could probably determine the sex of each by the time the donor plants have recovered from the re-potting.

Though males may have a tendency to be taller and thinner, I have not found this to be a good indicator if at all.Most plants will begin to show sex around 6-8 weeks even under 24 hrs of light, so get out your magnification and take a close look. With only 250 w, I see no need to go above 3 gallons of soil mix.

good luck Foster

python · 02-12-08, 23:13

a good generalization is to flower when the plants are 1/3 to 1/2 of your flower room height
as the plants will double to triple in size (with an HPS that is) -----

i personally go like 2 weeks germ (with floros) 4 weeks veg with a (400w MH)

golly · 02-13-08, 00:06

Ok, think i wanna keep it simple as possible - i'll just repot ,wait one week then flower.
If i take any clones , it would be after harvest by re-vedging i guess.
Need to finish up b4 summer heat builds in early May...

alounacara · 02-13-08, 00:30

You dont know the sex yet so dont make any decisions yet

twoguysupnorth · 02-13-08, 18:08

nice thick stem there. i would go for the simple bending over too, with a little more veg time afterwords. nice looking plants. 3 times the growth (stretching ) seems like a little much but maybe double. usually less depending. with hid lights(i have read) the wattage is cut in half for every foot from the light. so 1ft from the light it would/should be 125w, then another ft 60.25w and so on.

golly · 02-17-08, 11:51

Ok,, Got em potted up to 5 gal tubs and dropped the light cycle to 18hrs..

Made my first blunder as i switched to HPS light - was too close to the tops and burned those orange spots..DOHH...!

Began bending the taller one with a wire tie down..
Will go to 12hrs in a few days at 51/2 weeks..

btw these are not monster bud - they're "super bud" a 70% sativa ..The leaves look very similar to the published norm for this strain , so that's good..

CoyoteMesc · 02-17-08, 12:32

They look really strong. I'm excited

twoguysupnorth · 02-18-08, 14:02

they look good. i think i was supposed to be talking about the lumens diminishing, not the watts. sorry.

Hash_Man · 02-18-08, 16:23

That's some thick stock

and the side branches coming wayyy from

the bottom did you supercrop to do that? why did you switch and

whats the watts on the HPS?

golly · 02-18-08, 18:49

All i did was pinch or fimm the top bud on each...This created 4 new shoots at the very top...Can't remember what "supercropping" is..

I switched up the light because the 250 seemed a bit small ,or soon will be..
Using a 600W HPS now,, Being as i have to wait for sexing - will need this bigger bulb for now...
The plants were about 16 ins from the bulb when they burned, but now more like 26...

Hash_Man · 02-19-08, 17:26

Well that's really cool Good luck

The shape of that larger plant made me think of a solution for me.

latter man

golly · 02-23-08, 12:26

Finally dropped to 12/12 now at 6 weeks..
Still bending them over gradually..I think i'm seeing some preflower type action but cannot determine anything yet..I'm counting on the tall one being a male, so i can move him out to the GH..
Took these flash pix right after the light goes off and notice the leaves begin to droop in the dark...

Hash_Man · 02-24-08, 14:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by golly

...........I'm counting on the tall one being a male......

They say the taller ones are males but how do they really know?

Quote:

Originally Posted by golly

. notice the leaves begin to droop in the dark...

I wonder what that means? I sometimes have noticed mine are nearly straight up when the lights are just on, kinda like me a many years ago

golly · 02-28-08, 11:44

Decided to Scrog the potential female ..Jammed 4 stainless steel rods into each corner of the tub and attatched a metal grid with clothes pins ,so i can adjust if ness..
Kinda had to smush down the plant a bit to help spread it out..
Think that'll work...?

About 1 week in 12/12 now...Pic is color adjusted..

golly · 03-08-08, 12:44

Two weeks into 12/12 and both plants turned out to be girls.

Good thing i have this Sodium lamp..
The shorter plant is growing thru the screen , while the taller one has just been bent and tied around the outer edges..
They seem to be doing ok but some of the new growth is a bit lighter green than i would like..

twoguysupnorth · 03-08-08, 15:15

healthy looking golly. i am not sure obout the lighter color though.

Jony 8) · 03-08-08, 15:38

its not too late to go to the neareast growshopp and buy som bud xl...
or simpley som fertiliser rich in iron and phosphore ..... buy the best one...

do not owerdose !!

golly · 03-08-08, 16:25

I'm using earth juice bloom + trace elements ,I've proly been too stingy with the nutes..
Also running a bubble bucket of beneficial bacteria which is added at each watering..
Was thinking that mebbe Iron or Sulphur deficiency could be the reason for the lighter green new growth..

Do u guys usually remove the leaves that are under the screen and receiving little light..?

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02-12-08, 17:47	#1 (permalink)
golly modapotato Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5,206	Superbud growlog/When to initiate flowering..? Hey, i want to grow one of these two under a single 250W bulb.. They're 60% sativa at almost 5 weeks .. So how much will these continue to stretch once switched to 12/12...? The taller one is about 15inches.. I don't want it to outgrow the light and may SCROG it.. The other plant which i hope is male will go to the GH..They are ready to be re-potted and have been pinched once... Got any hints for a noob..Thnx Attached Thumbnails

02-12-08, 17:54	#3 (permalink)
Foster laziness of summer Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 973	FME most will at least double their size after initiating 12/12. Some Indicas may not, but most indica/sativa hybrids seem to. I'd go ahead and re-pot, give it a week or 2 to recover, and flower soon after to keep the best penetration available with your 250. Or do some bending, training. . Looks good so far Golly! Foster __________________ peace

02-12-08, 18:26	#4 (permalink)
massive042 thirdeyepryer Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 84	If it were me and those were the conditions I had, I would tie it from the top and bend until horizontal. Essentially you are making every node point a cola. With a sativa mix especially that baby will stretch!!! At least double probably triple when flowered. IMHO bending and training is your best option for maximized yield. gl!! __________________ "After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music. " Aldous Huxley

02-12-08, 19:21	#5 (permalink)
Hash_Man Mycophiliac Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 69	For a 250 watt bulb you probably want to bloom it right away, scrog is a very good idea. Is your 250 hps or MH? and is that what the plant are under right now? If it is MH it will stretch less, (keep your day/night temps within 5 degrees if possible and/or try Mr. Nodes, I use Bushmaster, they are a growth inhibitor made from kelp and you might not get any noticeable stretch at all. I only speak for Bushmaster but Mr. Nodes or others maybe similar, I spray with nitrozine 2-3 days before the switch then water with 5ml per gallon of Bushmaster @ bloom then Nitrozine 2-3 days after switch. You can use any good strong kelp product instead of Nitrozime, or Bushmaster alone at 7.5 -10 ml and flush 3-6 days after, then fert. as usual. note: 1/2 strength or less of bloom fert. @ switch Edit: also, those look like clones but if from seed and being heavier sativa. you would need more age on then IMO. Last edited by Hash_Man : 02-12-08 at 19:40. Reason: because

02-12-08, 20:08	#7 (permalink)
alounacara Picktish Texas Style.... Join Date: Jan 1972 Posts: 1,664	Golly those look mostly Indica to me which is a good thing because my Sativas stretched about 2.5 ft when i cut the light back I didnt pinch or cut back but i wanted natural colas for some reason with my grow... Are you shure those are 60% Sativas? __________________ Dont take a tone with me * So hard to please WDYWFM?

02-12-08, 20:38	#8 (permalink)
golly modapotato Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5,206	Thanx for the comments..These are seed grown "monster bud" heh ..supposed to be 60/40 ..They do have an Indica look to 'em though.. The light is Ceramic metal halide ,which i'm experimening with ..I do have a HPS backup. Seedlings were started under CFL 125W untill last week.. I do like the idea of tying the tops to a grid for better exposure [scrog] So i think i'll repot and wait another week to decide ..I plan to use a wide mouth 4-5 gallon tub with promix/perlite... Do u think the tall skinny one is likely a male..?

02-12-08, 21:25	#9 (permalink)
CoyoteMesc Howling Mad Moderator Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 3,088	Beautiful plants golly. My suggestion is this. If you were gonna let em grow vertical I would go ahead and put em in flower. Since your wanting to scrog em you will need some training. With training I would veg and train until you have all the desired sites through the screen. As you know strain, nutes, level of darkness all contribute to stretch. I would suggest zero N with a bloom fert. Complete darkness (so dark you cant see your hand 2 inches in front of your face). Im still learning so much. But wanted to give my 2 cents. Edit to say* impossible to tell sex from those pics. __________________ "well, since you asked so very fuckin' nicely, sure!" ~H3

02-12-08, 21:35	#10 (permalink)
BlacHaze Mycotopiate Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 231	I think the extra veg time will get you extra bud. I'm in week 5 of veg and will go at least 8. I agree with Massive that you should bend the tall one over. I would open up the shorter plant to allow more light to the interior. You want the interior branches to grow out instead of the top going up. If you planted both from natural seed (not feminized) then I think the tall one will be a male and the short one will be female. And I would use the HPS when you switch to flower. Even better, get a second ballast and use both lights for full spectrum and more lumens. Hard to tell those plants are from a noob, good luck. And since they are a good looking couple, you may want to pollinate a section of your female. If you get any females.

02-12-08, 21:42	#11 (permalink)
alounacara Picktish Texas Style.... Join Date: Jan 1972 Posts: 1,664	Ceramic lights are for parking lots but thats ok if you are still vegging your plants The tall one is most likely a male plant but dont bet on it Your plants look mostly Indica to me so dont worry so much about a huge stretch unless your grow area is only 5` high Your plants look good so far __________________ Dont take a tone with me * So hard to please WDYWFM?

02-12-08, 22:31	#12 (permalink)
golly modapotato Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5,206	Yeah, i was hoping to pollinate a branch for next time.. I guess my problem is, not knowing which is the Fem ..I don't have room to scrog train them both under this light.. Guess the only other choice is to go 12/12 to sex 'em then revert back to vedge..? Gotta say i'm pretty stoked bout these gurls ..I do grow some tropical plants but it's nothing like this deal here..Have to thank y'all for being such a bad influence and inspiring this grow...

02-12-08, 23:10	#15 (permalink)
massive042 thirdeyepryer Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 84	Yes, really the only way to know 100% on the sex is to flower and revert. Or take clones and flower(will take longer). After awhile you will be able to tell before flowering(or at least a good hunch), but do it anyway to be sure. They look nice and healthy. Also with a second look those do exhibit quite indica like qualities. Dark green, broad leaves. Keep us posted, interested to see which direction you go. Oh it makes me long for my garden... Good thing I have two homeboxes in the mail!! __________________ "After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music. " Aldous Huxley

02-12-08, 23:12	#16 (permalink)
Foster laziness of summer Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 973	Another idea to determine sex would be to take a cutting or two from each. Label accordingly, and give the cutting a minimum of 12 hrs darkness per day. You could probably determine the sex of each by the time the donor plants have recovered from the re-potting. Though males may have a tendency to be taller and thinner, I have not found this to be a good indicator if at all.Most plants will begin to show sex around 6-8 weeks even under 24 hrs of light, so get out your magnification and take a close look. With only 250 w, I see no need to go above 3 gallons of soil mix. good luck Foster __________________ peace

02-12-08, 23:13	#17 (permalink)
python Virtuoso Join Date: Apr 1973 Posts: 2,652	a good generalization is to flower when the plants are 1/3 to 1/2 of your flower room height as the plants will double to triple in size (with an HPS that is) ----- i personally go like 2 weeks germ (with floros) 4 weeks veg with a (400w MH)

02-13-08, 00:06	#18 (permalink)
golly modapotato Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5,206	Ok, think i wanna keep it simple as possible - i'll just repot ,wait one week then flower. If i take any clones , it would be after harvest by re-vedging i guess. Need to finish up b4 summer heat builds in early May...

02-13-08, 00:30	#19 (permalink)
alounacara Picktish Texas Style.... Join Date: Jan 1972 Posts: 1,664	You dont know the sex yet so dont make any decisions yet __________________ Dont take a tone with me * So hard to please WDYWFM?

02-13-08, 18:08	#20 (permalink)
twoguysupnorth Mycotopiate Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,438	nice thick stem there. i would go for the simple bending over too, with a little more veg time afterwords. nice looking plants. 3 times the growth (stretching ) seems like a little much but maybe double. usually less depending. with hid lights(i have read) the wattage is cut in half for every foot from the light. so 1ft from the light it would/should be 125w, then another ft 60.25w and so on.

02-17-08, 11:51	#21 (permalink)
golly modapotato Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5,206	Ok,, Got em potted up to 5 gal tubs and dropped the light cycle to 18hrs.. Made my first blunder as i switched to HPS light - was too close to the tops and burned those orange spots..DOHH...! Began bending the taller one with a wire tie down.. Will go to 12hrs in a few days at 51/2 weeks.. btw these are not monster bud - they're "super bud" a 70% sativa ..The leaves look very similar to the published norm for this strain , so that's good.. Attached Thumbnails

02-17-08, 12:32	#22 (permalink)
CoyoteMesc Howling Mad Moderator Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 3,088	They look really strong. I'm excited __________________ "well, since you asked so very fuckin' nicely, sure!" ~H3

02-18-08, 14:02	#23 (permalink)
twoguysupnorth Mycotopiate Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,438	they look good. i think i was supposed to be talking about the lumens diminishing, not the watts. sorry.

02-18-08, 16:23	#24 (permalink)
Hash_Man Mycophiliac Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 69	That's some thick stock and the side branches coming wayyy from the bottom did you supercrop to do that? why did you switch and whats the watts on the HPS?

02-18-08, 18:49	#25 (permalink)
golly modapotato Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5,206	All i did was pinch or fimm the top bud on each...This created 4 new shoots at the very top...Can't remember what "supercropping" is.. I switched up the light because the 250 seemed a bit small ,or soon will be.. Using a 600W HPS now,, Being as i have to wait for sexing - will need this bigger bulb for now... The plants were about 16 ins from the bulb when they burned, but now more like 26...

02-19-08, 17:26	#26 (permalink)
Hash_Man Mycophiliac Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 69	Well that's really cool Good luck The shape of that larger plant made me think of a solution for me. latter man

02-23-08, 12:26	#27 (permalink)
golly modapotato Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5,206	Finally dropped to 12/12 now at 6 weeks.. Still bending them over gradually..I think i'm seeing some preflower type action but cannot determine anything yet..I'm counting on the tall one being a male, so i can move him out to the GH.. Took these flash pix right after the light goes off and notice the leaves begin to droop in the dark... Attached Thumbnails

02-28-08, 11:44	#29 (permalink)
golly modapotato Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5,206	Decided to Scrog the potential female ..Jammed 4 stainless steel rods into each corner of the tub and attatched a metal grid with clothes pins ,so i can adjust if ness.. Kinda had to smush down the plant a bit to help spread it out.. Think that'll work...? About 1 week in 12/12 now...Pic is color adjusted.. Attached Thumbnails

03-08-08, 12:44	#30 (permalink)
golly modapotato Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5,206	Two weeks into 12/12 and both plants turned out to be girls. Good thing i have this Sodium lamp.. The shorter plant is growing thru the screen , while the taller one has just been bent and tied around the outer edges.. They seem to be doing ok but some of the new growth is a bit lighter green than i would like.. Attached Thumbnails

03-08-08, 15:15	#31 (permalink)
twoguysupnorth Mycotopiate Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,438	healthy looking golly. i am not sure obout the lighter color though.

03-08-08, 15:38	#32 (permalink)
Jony 8) Mycophage Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 111	its not too late to go to the neareast growshopp and buy som bud xl... or simpley som fertiliser rich in iron and phosphore ..... buy the best one... do not owerdose !! __________________ My misson is to free the minds fom the matrix but i must start with my own! Peace

03-08-08, 16:25	#33 (permalink)
golly modapotato Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5,206	I'm using earth juice bloom + trace elements ,I've proly been too stingy with the nutes.. Also running a bubble bucket of beneficial bacteria which is added at each watering.. Was thinking that mebbe Iron or Sulphur deficiency could be the reason for the lighter green new growth.. Do u guys usually remove the leaves that are under the screen and receiving little light..?