Experiment: Substrate as casing (Supercake Formula)

[eatyualive]

Originally Posted by dice4717

Hey thats not too shabby Eats.lol
Kinda sorta a bit I guess.
Compared to your others.
Its nice to hear things are starting
to head back in the right direction though.
Its crazy how much a dif the fae from the polyfill
being to tight, or whatever was wrong with it made.
So you really pulled 85% of the pins of that one?
Damn imagine if they would all grown out
man that woulda been amazing.
There is always next time.
Hey how big are the holes for FAE?

1" drill bit holes.

dunno it looked like 85% when i picked em. could be more like 70% there were so many pins. its a bad pic bc many of them were starting to abort but there were tons of pins. the condensation makes it difficult to see. this is after a two day no fanning.

side by side there were tons of clusters all over.

[dice4717]

Yeah I def can see the difference.
Its a shame bro.
The mycelium still looks great so thats a plus.
You can see how much moisture is on the casing
the 1st pic it was a lot, but you can tell its not as bad now.

[eatyualive]

Originally Posted by dice4717

Yeah I def can see the difference.
Its a shame bro.
The mycelium still looks great so thats a plus.
You can see how much moisture is on the casing
the 1st pic it was a lot, but you can tell its not as bad now.

its still very heavy though. definitely the reason one bin had that contam. this 3.5" deep substrate is definitely producing tons of moisture. enough so that there is still pooling water underneath the black plastic.

[eatyualive]

so all below except the orange cap are supercake formula. minus the interruption from the air exchange. the bins have recuperated nicely by opening up two polyfil holes. one on each short end of the tub at the top of the tub has worked fine. its been in a room for about 1/3 of the day with a fan. the other 2/3 of the day its been sitting in the chamber. but the air exchange is still working well.

here is a side by side comparison of tex yellow cap and orange cap. much different growth characteristics. the oc has some meaty orange fat fruits popping up now. looking very nice although not as abundant as usual. the sub dunk didn't go well. just needed more water so it slowed the growth down a bit.




other than that the one pesh tub that had the full pinset has been harvested and dunked for 12 hours. it was then laid out and is now shooting off some monsters. conclusion was that all of these problems were due to air exchange. the tex oc with the substrate as casing fruited a nice 2z dry harvest even though it did have some rosecomb on some of the fruits. its now shooting off some very red pins that are completely another shade of red compared to the other pins in that tub.

[Hippie3]

[eatyualive]

Originally Posted by Hippie3

supercake formula

gonna add it to all subs from now on... can't hurt..

[eatyualive]

ok so let me tell you now. these pics are deceiving. some of the fruits look about the same size and definitely some are larger. but i assure you now, that all the tubs with supercake formula bulked up the yield just by harvesting and feeling by hand alone. all fruits are much denser and almost every fruit that matured are almost touching the tops of the bins. if they aren't touching the tops, they were so heavy they fell over when i picked up the bin to move it for harvest.
list of observations:
1) All fruits are much denser
2) most if not all pins matured when the air exchange issue was fixed. (if these issues were fixed ahead of time you would be seeing full canopy flushes. its just half the tubs were aborting out and were harvested when the pins died.)
3) Very little aborts
4) easy harvest
5) easy printing(most caps were at least 3" big or larger)
6) the supercake formula speeds up incubation time by half even with the same amount of spawn being used. (a test is in the works now that uses a smaller amount of spawn to sub ratio to see if this speeds up compared to the regular methods used. this consists of 1:1:1 ratios of strawnet/coir/verm with 10% dusting of horse poo. no supercake formula was added and about 1 and 1/3 of a quart of spawn was used to a 1 turkey sub volume ratio for this test. this is similar to the normal method used for several years so this next test will be to see if it speeds up the substrate to even or at least a bit faster than the regular spawn run times.)
7) harvest was very easy all fruits were twisted with ease
8) by feeling alone all fruits are much denser and feel heavier in comparison to the regular methods used.
9) pinning time and fruiting time seemed to slow down just a bit. this was most likely due to the air exchange issue that was previously mentioned. with the spawn run time speeding up, this balanced all times out accordingly. so, the conclusion on this is that another 5-10 tests will be done to figure this out.


here is the previous list above that mentions what tub is what for comparsion. the pesh are a wash. 4 tubs that stalled out were tossed outside because this slow strain takes up too much time to deal with. need something a bit quicker. can't waste all this time waiting for it. although pesh is a great strain.
previous list minus mazatec and pesh. both either contaminated or didn't do well. next text will have to be spruced up a bit on these strains.
2) tex clone orange cap(spawned with substrate as casing) on 3rd flush still shooting out stubbies. however, the last flush has some giants in it and some decent sized fruits. the thin casing as substrate ended up working against the cause. it produced smaller fruits and for some reason even had some mutation. may have been a rubbing alcohol issue. the tub is still flushing well although it hasn't bee dunked. the fruits just keep popping up, allbeit smaller than wanted but we definitely want this type of pinning. the pins are so dense you can't even see a spot on the surface that isn't a pin. makes harvest difficult yes. but the flushes outweigh the negatives.
3) tex clone oc(spawned regular) these tubs had the big fruits that are the regular tex clone orange cap. the 2nd flush is popping up fatties and randomely. a few were harvested a few more popup. the beauty of this strain is that it continually flushes. mix that in with a dunk and its unstoppable.
txoccl2.jpg
this is about as light as this strain gets. at the most it will get a darker yellow color. the yellow cap will be yellow and white at the tips. you can see below.
texocrcl1.jpg
4) tex clone yc(spawned regular) this bin was dunked 1st flush. half dunked. there were still a tiny bit of fat pins on one side of the substrate. it was dunked with pins and allowed to fruit. will be dunked again. but this test bin definitely the fruits are very soft, they are not near as dense as the subs with supercake in it. imagine a 120lb guy standing next to brock lesnar. thats the difference..lol. even though it may appear the fruits are larger they definitely are not as dense.
texycclregularsub.jpg
anyway there are several bins of tex strain yc clone with suerpcake formula in them. here are them below. all fatties! very nice and just wait once all these issues with fruiting are worked out...its gonna bang. think we are getting the feel for this setup now. the open air holes inside the chamber seem to do the trick. even with the door sealed. the extra air in the chamber works together with the volume of air in each chamber. its working out great. and give them a few hours a day of oscillating fan open holes and all, and it works to perfection. you can tell 100% of how miserable the flushes were looking before those holes were opened up and now. their just banging!
texclsc4.jpgtexyccl3chamber.jpg texycclsc3.jpgtexycsc2.jpg texycsc3.jpgtexycsupercake1.jpgtexycsccase.jpg
here are some prints being made. wired up some type of thing to hold the caps above the foil when printing using bonzai tree wire. orange cap tex. hip, see how big these are? this is the same exact spawn used with the other tub as substrate casing thing. its quite a difference. all these fruits are huge as they were in the first flush. and none are smaller than about 6".
prints.jpg
heres an idea of density for your reference. very dense. probably will clone some specimen next go round.

[livewire420]

[Hippie3]

eats-
i'm gonna want you to be my sales rep for my supercake mix .

[dice4717]

Good Job Eats

[eatyualive]

more updates. lets just say this supercake formula fuckin rocks!

i have to thank hip for inventing it and floppy peter for forcing me to use it in my subs bc his results are so good and he pushed me to get off my ass and try it. thanks!

mature fatties. so many to print not enough space. printing sheets of this for the topia now. both strains! only about 6 caps per page of prints bc the caps are so large.



thats for topia giving me the help, and hopefully this will give back to topia. i feel this place has helped me take the next step thanks everyone. there are so many good threads, people, and areas on this site. its 2nd to none!

been a long road getting this strain going again. about a year to say the least. had about 3-4 complications down the road. but the tex oc and tex yc will be available for the topia!

eats-
i'm gonna want you to be my sales rep for my supercake mix .

not much i need to do, the results speak for themselves. once the small kinks in this armor are worked out. you will see some dense ass flushes from here on out. i think i figured out the problem which was something so simple it was overlooked. air exchange. i mean yeah i thought they were getting enough air with two fannings a day. but thats not enough with these iris bins. they seal too tight.

opening holes worked out great!




see this yellow white im talking about. this is the closest resemblance to the original...

[Hippie3]

nice bigguns

[eatyualive]

anyway comparison of some smaller tex orange cap to yellow cap. all yellow cap with supercake formula got huge like this.

this isn't even 1/3 of the harvest yet...jeez!

supercake formula downside: too much to harvest! damn might have to stop using it...lol that blue tray is at least 12-14" from top to bottom of that pic.

[TVCasualty]

Great work, as usual...


I thought this earlier comment was pretty funny:

Originally Posted by eatyualive

i sometimes tell people to do a setup like this with water and the sub floating on it. and people are like " thats the worst advice i have ever heard"...so take it as it is.

I guess that means the people blowing off your advice haven't bothered to check out your pictures...

[eatyualive]

Originally Posted by TVCasualty

Great work, as usual...


I thought this earlier comment was pretty funny:



I guess that means the people blowing off your advice haven't bothered to check out your pictures...

lol, well my buddy doesn't have much luck with dunking. but i tried explaining to him about the thread i saw here with the grow in the fishtank with the fish and everything in it. he was blown away by the pics i showed him. and i told him that the process used produces a microclimate in this respect. similar to an area long a small pond or in a cow field that is near a small lake. ive seen this in fields ive picked at where there were fruits growing near the lake but not a few hundred yards away. this seems to keep the humidity up just a bit to create a micro climate along with close vegetation.

so i tried explaining to him that these tubs kinda produce that standing water idea. he wasn't having it though. didn't want to even try it. but i wouldn't blame him if he has no luck dunking. however, the guy can grow fruits off camel crap lol..and hes a good grower too but probably doesn't have the confidence to test the waters. i completely understand it in a way. i devote about half the space to screwed up experiments. half the time they work, half the time they don't. even if at times its a headache. its great to figure out new things..

i mean you can see above where things screwed up and now they are fixed lol...its fun watching things fall together.

[golly]

Awesome grow Eats...

I couldn't see what your referring to with "re-creating the standing water idea" in your tubs..

[eatyualive]

in this picture you can see the pooling water. this is what i meant. the condensation at times creates pooling water under the black plastic. after first flush i was pouring out water before the dunk. there was a good amount of water under each substrate. this was purely from the condensation alone from the chamber. no extra water was added or anything. but what was meant, is that its similar to lets say a lake or small pond or even water detention pond. foaf was doing some outdoor grows near a drainage ditch or detention area with many plants around it. the stagnate water created a very humid microenvironment which was just behind this building only. only for about 100 yards or so. you walk 100 yards either way and the humidity was half what it was in that area. this is due to the stagnate water sitting in this ditch. was just kinda comparing it to the pooling water under the tubs. it just seems these tubs recreate that particular type of micro climate. im no expert on micro climates but did study it a bit in college. this is just an observation really that seems to be seen in several different places over the years. most of them in cow fields. found one cow field that was a floodplain. the wooded area around it was swamp. it would flood about 2-3 feet during 3 day rain fest. after the water evaporated, the cow patties that were underwater for a few days would then explode like a natural dunk.

there was also a field in texas that i used to go to. it actually had a small lake in one of the cowfields. the fruits were more abundant near the lake. so we would go near the lake to pick.

[eatyualive]

beating this to death but man. these fruits are touching the lids...

[eatyualive]

weird didn't upload

[golly]

Ok , thanx ,,I get it now...

They are good size for the sub volume...

[eatyualive]

this is stacked about 10" high...one tub.

[floppypeter]

[eatyualive]

final update for first flush. conclusion is by eye and just volume alone about triple the regular flush. this is just judging by the amount of space its taking up.

here is a 2nd flush of the pesh. these look more like malabar lol.. not malabar though.

so as for yield so far for comparison. we had an 8 tub run last round. this yielded 1 elbow dry off 8 bins. isn't that much. in fact, a few bins just didn't perform that well. this comparison is going to be a 4 bin comparison with basically double the recipe per bin. so its about the same volume of substrate, substrate weight ratio, but half the square footage surface area of the 8 bins. so far, its looking like at least two fold if not 3 fold yield...lets see how it turns out. definitely taking up alot of space...

9.jpg

7.jpg

4.jpg

[eatyualive]

well its not triple the yield. but its 1.5 times the previous yield in a 4 tub comparison opposed to an 8 tub flush. its the same volume of substrate so we basically pulled more yield out of the subs just by adding about 1 cup of super ca