Anyone know about Boats? *or like to restore cars.

[CoyoteMesc]

I dislike for my fiends to only call when they want something. With this said, all of my friends that know about boats I hardly ever talk to. So calling the first time in many months just to ask a question just seems rude to me.
How ever I speak to many of you daily so I have a question to any who know about working on boats.
I know very minimal.
I got an I/O OMC. The water pump had a bad impeller and had melted the entire housing. I replace this and put in an entire new water pump. However I did not pay attention as to the direction of the impeller(thinking it would work itself out the way it need to on its own).
I took this boat out the other day to test everything. The hose on the engine that the water travels through was very stiff and hard when the motor was on.(I guess this is the way it should be?) after about 45min of running it I decided everything was ok and decided to load it back on the trailer. Then and only then I checked those hoses again while the engine was running and they were not hard they were very soft like no water. When I took the housing back off the impeller was in one direction and two flaps on the rubber impeller were broke.
questons:
1) is the way I installed this the cause of the broken impeller(it was never ran out of the river)
2) should the hoses on the engine be tight or spongy or in between.
3) how do i know that the water is circling the entire engine.
It is an 88 Bayliner Capri 3.0 Gm 4-cylinder
OMC outdrive, I/O

any advice and or help would be greatly appreciated . Thanks in advance/.

[alligator]

3) how do i know that the water is circling the entire engine.

if the water pump is operating correctly you shoud see a stream of water pissing out the back when the engine is running

1) is the way I installed this the cause of the broken impeller(it was never ran out of the river)

that very well could be the cause

2) should the hoses on the engine be tight or spongy or in between.

i dont think there should be much pressure on the hose during operation as the water should flow freely through the engine and out the pisser

Your water impeller blade have to be in the correct direction . When the impeller is on the shaft it must be turned clockwise while installing it into the the cup. Do you notice water coming out of any place it shouldn't on the lower unit? when its in the water and you accerlerate the engine does the oulet water stream get stronger?

[Quine]

Gee Coyote, I know it's raining alot...but ya think you need to get that Ark ready just yet?

[CoyoteMesc]

well, I did notice at first that water was coming out of the top of the lower unit. . I took off the top of it and noticed that the housing for the pump was melted. I knew right then what had happened and bought a new pump kit which included everything new. Now that is fixed. No water coming out anywhere it shouldn't. As far as the pee hole well thats all under water and when hooked to a hose it looks to be coming out as it should but with my limited knowledge how can i tell if its circling the entire motor then coming out. It doesn't just shoot a piss hole of water like an outboard it also comes out of the front of the lower unit. It looks like its suppose to do that?
I dunno though. I do know that the starboard side of the hose before i left the dock was tight/stiff and the port side hose was as if nothing was in it, very easily squeezed. Then when i returned both starboard and port sides were easily squeezed unlike before i left.
So i checked the water pump visually and found that two of the flippers on the impeller were already broke.
So i dunno?

[CoyoteMesc]

Quine,
ya wanna go for a boat ride?

[viaje_champinon]

My Boat has through hull exhaust rather than go under water & exit fron the out drive, but i would imagine that the hoses will soften as they heat up, i know nothing about the impella direction but common scence tells me that it has a specified direction for proper use.

[fof]

did you find all of the pieces of the old impeller and the new one that
broke. they are probably stuck in the cooling system someware. did you lube up the new impeller when you installed it?
I have an older manual but i think you should rotate the impeller clockwise when you are installing it.


fof

[Rasa]

I dont know a whole lot on boats, Just what I help a friend with, But I know if the gasket behind the propeller is in wrong, (or in at all, lotta ppl forget this part and are sorry after), then it can cause some of the same probs you are mentioning, and then some!!! Sorry I dont know more, Good luck, brother, Bless, Ras

[maliki]

coyte what brand and make model is the boat engine.??
With the water cups on and the hose flowing water to the mottor
typicaly even without the mottor runing the water should come out of the
water exit port. If it doesnt you may have a blockage in one of the ports .
Sometimes with the pump off if you flow water from a hose backwards thru the system you find that there was some small chunck of something caught up in there.
I know a fair amount when it comes to engines. Be they boat lawn mower mottor cycle car wahtever .. I do engines per say..
If you can shot me the model of yours I should be able to write up a step by step guide to reparing the water pump..
Ive done my fair share of my own and others.

As for circling the entire engine with water if it is comming out of the exit hole and going into the water inlet it stands to reason the water is traveling the entire cooling system.
So long as there isnt something majorly fubared in the engine case its self..

[Lazlo]

An I/O with an impeller? That's a new one to me. It should have a standard water pump on the engine, just like a car.

Anyways. You can take the hose off of the exit side of the thermostat housing to make sure water's circulating through the engine, impeller or pump driven. Just do it for a second.

What kind of engine does this boat have? Volvo or something? I've never seen an impeller in an I/O. Weird.

[CoyoteMesc]

It is an 88 Bayliner Capri 3.0 Gm 4-cylinder
OMC outdrive, I/O. Do you need some other info?
If so I can get it if you do.

i know nothing about the impella direction but common scence tells me that it has a specified direction for proper use.

yeah I know it goes a specific direction but its rubber and I figured it would flip in the direction it needed to be w/o breaking two pellers off.
Yes I used vaseline to lube it. I fits tight so just getting everything in was a bit of a task. I have since read that a temp zip tie can aid in the installation. Just remove it after the impeller if half way in.
Yes the gasket and steal wear plate are new and put on correctly.
My main concern now it what Maliki is hitting on.
Maliki, the water is coming out of a side port when the motor isn't running. When it is running it is coming out of an opening in front of the lower unit(is that the exit after it circles the engine?) and the port
What gets me is that I had so much water pressure on the starboard(im asumming this is the entry) side of the engine when it was running(after the new impeller was installed) and none on the port side(which looks to me like the exit side by the way the hoses are ran) Then after some time on the water I noticed a loss of pressure all together even on the entrance side. So I'm like, "wtf, is the water pump gone out again?" And when i looked the thing had a couple pieces missing off it.
I will flush it out tonight like you guys said and see what happens. Maybe its clogged up. I just was thinking that maybe there was something blocking it from exiting the correct way since there was so much pressure on one side and none on the other..
It looked like it was coming back out the front of the lower unit but why wouldn't some pressure be on the exit side. Or it seems there should be no pressure on either side, eh?

[CoyoteMesc]

An I/O with an impeller? That's a new one to me. It should have a standard water pump on the engine, just like a car.

No pump on the engine. I wish it was though.
Its a GM 3.0 4 cylinder.

[CoyoteMesc]

here is what I bought and replaced.

[maliki]

http://www.boatengine.net/water_pumps/
Give this one a shot a bit of reading but what you seek is there...
And slao this one is a parts breakdown of your upper gear case with the pump.
http://www.boatparts.ca/sitebuilderc...rts-layout.jpg

[Lazlo]

That outdrive must be kind of old huh? I can ask my father if you want? I'll be talking to him tonight.

[alligator]

a friend of mine had dirt dobbers build a nest in the exit port. that can really cause blockage too. good luck

[Lazlo]

Oh. That's just like an outboard impeller. The tines should be scooping water into the cooling system. So just see which way the shaft's moving when you turn the engine over, to see which way the tines should be heading.

[CoyoteMesc]

Ok, I got the impeller replaced and everything washed out. It is doing great now me thinks.
The pressure came back to the entrance side and with the info provided and you guys, the water is exiting perfect too. Thank you guys so much. After I finished this afternoon and everything was working, my first thought was you guys

yeah Laz, its an 88 model. I didn't have the money to stick in a new one and I got this one for a great bargain. As soon as I finish the restoration of the interior and such I will post pics of the before and after if you guys care to see. I could tell from the moment I saw and heard her run that she just needed TLC and a small amount of cash.
I also got two repair manuals today for my OMC model. Thats got to help.
BTW, with the casing facing me, I had to install the impeller clock wise.

YOU GUYS KICK ASS. Thanks so much.
I'll keep ya posted on the future progression.
CM

[CoyoteMesc]

ps, thank you Maliki for the sites too, I book marked 'em...

[CoyoteMesc]

Still some work needed but it coming along nicely I think.



Before and after



B&A



B&A



Before, Before and After



B&A



still a lot of work left but its coming around, Ive been out three times now and I cant wait til she's finished.

[Lazlo]

Sheesh! You've got'r in tip top shape now don't ya!?

There's a boat down the street that i've been eying up for a few weeks now and now there's a for sale sign on it for dirt cheep. She's a little rough but, would be a great bay boat with a minimal amount of work. I think I may snag it up so we have something to use in the fall for fishing. I need something with a cuddy cabin or some kind of cabin for that matter now that we've got the little one.

Your boat looks nice man! Nice work.

[CoyoteMesc]

Thanks Laz,
I still need to button some seems and finish the motor cover, etc, etc
This is my first attempt ever with carpet and seats. It went ok for my first time and no idea wtf I was doing...lol. I figured that it had to look better than it did before no matter what the outcome.
Im enjoying looking at it in the befores and afters. Its fun, still plenty to do though for sure.
But Im loving it. I may post the final results in a few weeks.
Good luck with your boat. Hope it all goes well for ya. Im sure it will earn you some points from your little one..lol

[Dank Side Of The Shroom]

lookn good. we got a 22 foot sea ray inboard. boats are great fun.

I just know that if it floats, flies, or fucks, it is cheaper to rent.

[CoyoteMesc]

Next Project








I have the patches welded and seam/weld seal in the floor, it is getting closer to have all metal and rust removed from the floor pans.

[CoyoteMesc]

My dad has three garages and is kind enough to lend me one.
It is in another county but not too far. I get to work on it a few hours a month.
Here is a few that inspire me:

[CoyoteMesc]

I went with this car because when complete it looks good, not many have them at the shows, and its cheap. So a good learner too.

[Ben Dover]

Hell yeah buddy! I love projects. Keep us posted on the progress!

[eastwood]

FORD = Found On Road Dead


Gluck with your project CM an keep us updated.

[SilvrHairDevil]

I kinda skipped through this whole thread and I didn't notice if there was mention of why the first impeller melted and if that situation got fixed.

Also didn't figure out if it has a water jacket/heat exchanger.

But I guess if it's okay now, there's no problem.

[troutlips]

Ford = First on race day!
Hey CM, is that a mid 70's Comet with a V-8 ?

[CoyoteMesc]

Good man!
73 Maverick. Same as a comet minus the front end. Hood, grill.

Maverick/comet = same car really.

Yeah 302 in it.

If you see the yellow one above, that is a comet. All the others are mavericks.

I will put a 69.5 to 72 front bumper on it. In 73 the put a mid size bumper on the front and in 74+ the went with a huge bumper on the front and rears.

I like the small bumpers.

The reason I posted the yellow comet is because I like the way they cut and rolled the wheel wells. They also did the same on the burnt orange maverick at the end.

[CoyoteMesc]

Its so hard to restore a car when your furniture needs it too.


A work in progress. Anyone have a suggestion on a grit of sand paper to use to take some of the shine off? Just a tad of shine but enough to level the poly a bit?

[SilvrHairDevil]

I was a spray finisher in another life.

How much leveling does the poly need? Is it brushed on Minwax?

If it's just rough to the touch, you could get some paste wax and some 0000 steel wool and give it a polishing. That will take down the gloss and replace it with a glow. If it's Minwax, best to let it fully dry for a couple weeks before waxing.

If you clearcoated it some other way, tell me the details and I'll be able to give advice.

[CoyoteMesc]

You hit the nail on the head.
It is brushed on minwax.

The imperfections are not so much you can feel them too much.
If you blow up the pics I posted you may be able to see the
light waves. They are light but visible when the light hits just right.

I will wait a couple of weeks before treatment.
What wax/polish do you recommend and thank
you for your help SHD

Tried to rep you but evidently I have done that recently.
Says I need to spread the love.

[SilvrHairDevil]

That's kinda strange - so far as I can tell from my user cp, you haven't repped me, at least not in the past 2 months.

I enlarged your pics and I do see the brush marks. In future, try "tipping off" the final coat of varnish, or use a foam brush or a spray gun. That way the marks will be able to level themselves before the stuff hardens.

For this one - after the poly is well cured (you can't dent it with a fingernail), get some 320, 400 and 600 grit wet - dry emery cloth.

Start with the 320 and use a hard block. Sand in the direction of the grain until you don't see any more shiny spots when you clean the powder off the top. This will level the brush marks.

Using a hard block will help keep you from running over the edge and cutting through the color. It also helps with the leveling process.

Next, use the 400. Same thing - sand in the direction of the grain, clean off the sanding dust with a damp rag. You are now sanding out the scratches left by the 320.

Then, moisten the top with a dribble of paint thinner or Varsol and work it with the 600. This should lose any tiny sanding scratches that may have formed with the other grits.

Then use the paste wax. It comes in round tins. I think Johnson & Johnson makes it. If you can't find any try Oxblood colored shoe polish.

Using the 0000 steel wool, you can apply the wax, then let it dry and polish it out with a soft rag. Don't get a build-up of polish on the top - just a nice thin, even coat.

I think I remembered everything. Any questions - just ask.

[CoyoteMesc]

cool thanks a million.
I am familiar with hard paint so you make perfect since to me.
Ill let you know how it goes.

I dont know about the rep thing man, look below.

[SilvrHairDevil]

Thanks for trying. It's the thought that counts.