urgent-LSD blotter adulterant

[neeb]

http://www.usdoj.gov/dea/programs/fo...05/mg1005.html


WACH OUT FOR LSD COMING FROM SF. CALLIFORNIA I TRIED IT THOUGHT IT WAS ACID AND IT WAS DOB IV TRIPPED ON THE REAL DEAL IN MY DAYS AND THIS WAS TO CLOSE FOR THE COMFORT OF THE ACID TRIBES---> PLEAS READ IMPORTANT

there is alot of acid around now and with the giant money drive and scams that have been going around, FAKE LSD shit im tierd of always having to test the blotter thats going around here in SF. CA.

whell my brothers of the acid tribe there is devistation witch i have a pic off. back in the 60's Alexander Shulgin invented dob nice medicine but way to close to how acid acts on the body it mimics lsd's effects

QUARTER INCH BLOTTER PAPPER BEING SOLD ALL OVER THE US in blotter and liquid if in liquid form and cold its clowdey my friend got extremly sick because of the mistaken identity


DOB is a phenethylamine with a character similar to 2C-B but several times longer in duration. Because of this duration, many people prefer to do it earlier in the day. Caution...DOB takes a fairly long time to onset (up to 3 hours) for most people. Do not redose thinking you haven't taken enough.

As the effects of DOB first come on, the user feels a rush of energy which can be exhilerating or uncomfortable, depending on the person and the dose. A small majority of people report slightly less stomach discomfort than with 2C-B, although, as with all substances, each person reacts differently and there are also reports of higher discomfort than with 2C-B. Some people also report a greater ability to both eat and sleep with DOB than with LSD.

As DOB settles in, it has a long plateau (3-10 hours, depending on person and dose). Higher doses extend the length in addition to increasing the effects. .Some people boost their DOB experience with a small supplement between T+3 and T+6 hours. The booster usually kicks in a bit faster than the original dose (45 minutes).

light doses of DOB last from 6-12
hours medium doses of DOB last from 8-16 hours
heavy doses of DOB can last more than 24 hours
see DOB Dosages

As with many other entheogens, its often best to avoid eating for at least 2 hours (4 is better) beforehand and don't eat until after the peak.

Light Effects: (plateau between 3 and 6 hours)
An increase in energy, feeling of mental clarity, opening of mental space, less confusing than low doses of LSD, very light visual activity, visual patterns superimposed on vision, enhanced texture perception, shift in colors. Some people find it possible to sleep on low doses of DOB, though probably not at the peak.

Body load usually manageable. Nervousness, edginess, some body discomfort, stomach tension, yawning.

Medium Effects: (plateau between 4 and 8 hours)
Increased duration, energizing, pronounced visual effects, marked clarity and reduction of emotions. Some people suggest this might be a good therapeutic tool in cases where excessive emotion might be a problem.

Fairly high body load. Muscle and jaw tension, tension headache, eye discomfort, achy back spasms, nausea, general body discomfort.

Strong Effects: (plateau between 6 and 12 hours)
Long duration, visual brightening, able to connect with ideas, heart-opening happiness.

Overdose: (3.5 + mg)
Reports of moderate overdoses appear to often be the result of individuals deciding an hour after their original dose that because they aren't feeling anything they didnt take enough. Be Careful! DOB can take up to 3 hours to onset for some individuals.

The overdose experience seems to be one of memory loss, irrational and sometimes violent behavior, and the possibility of causing harm to oneself (not noticing pain?).

CONTRA-INDICATIONS
DOB can be quite harmful at high doses. Significant overdoses can cause serious vasso-constriction of the extremeties...possibly resulting in nerve damange and/or gangrene. There are unconfirmed reports of two people who accidentally ingested 75mg (over 30x the regular dosage) and needed to have their legs amputated because their circulation had shut off and caused gangrene in their legs.

The use of DOB can be a problem for those with circulatory problems, heart ailments, glaucoma, hypertension, hepatic or renal disease, aneurism, or stroke history.

DRUG INTERACTIONS
DOB can be dangerous if mixed improperly with other drugs especially MAOI's or other liver-enzyme affecting chemicals. Mixing with stimulants is not recommended.

GHB:
For some people, GHB has little psychoactive effect during a DOB experience, though it can be used to help sleep at the end.

ALCOHOL:
There seem to be some cross-tolerance between DOB and alcohol. This means if you have been or are going to be drinking alcohol during your DOB experience, the dosage of DOB should be lower.



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LSD or DOB?
American Journal of Psychiatry
Letter to the Editor
Vol 139, Dec, 1982, 1649
by W. Marvin Davis, PhD



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


SIR: In "Mania Associated with LSD Ingestion" (November 1981 issue), C. Raymond Lake, M.D., Ph.D., and associates described a patient who experienced a typical manic episode 3 weeks after taking an oral dose (on a slip of blotter paper) of what he thought was LSD. Chemical confirmation of the substance ingested was impossible. Dr. Lake and associates believed that "the medium, cost, time until onset, duration of symptoms, and their characteristics strongly indicate" the agent taken was LSD or an LSD analogue. They also stated that because of high potency, allowing effective doses in the microgram range, "LSD is the only drug of abuse dispensed on a slip of blotter paper." This mistaken information may have weighed unduly in their virtual acceptance of the substance involved as LSD. May we suggest that an alternative possibility exists?
Another hallucinogen is purveyed in blotter paper units. That agent is 4-bromo-2,5-dimethoxyamphetamine, known frequently in laboratory studies as DOB but also as bromo-DMA (1). According to 19 anonymous brief notations in the Drug Enforcement Administration bulletin Microgram (vols. VI-XIV, 1973-1981), since 1972 DOB has repeatedly been found sold in blotter paper doses in the United States, New Zealand, Australia, the United Kingdom, West Germany, and Greece. Extractable drug averaged .93-2.8 mg per dosage unit for analyses from the United States. Delliou (1) found individual squares to contain 1.4-4.6 mg. In most sales of DOB on blotter paper, it was being misrepresented as LSD (caveat emptor!), to which it is unrelated chemically.

A clinical study of DOB (2) found .2 mg to be the minimum detectable oral dose; the highest dose tried, 2.0 mg, produced "intellectual and emotional stimulation" and perceptual enhancement but not perceptual distortions or hallucinations. However, outside of clinical trials DOB reportedly causes not only hallucinations but also "disorientation often leading to panic state" (1).

LSD is rapidly absorbed after an oral dose and initial symptoms usually appear within a few minutes; visual illusions and perceptual distortions occur within the second or third hour (3). First perception of drug action occurred as late as 2-4 hours after oral doses of DOB in 4 of 13 subjects (2). A pharmacokinetic study (4) showed that DOB (or a metabolite) began to concentrate in the brain only 3 hours after an oral dose. DOB is said (1) to have a longer duration, 12-24 hours, than LSD, 8-12 hours. Both of these characteristics of DOB match those of the drug ingested in Dr. Lake and associates' case --slow onset (3 hours) and a long recovery time (18-24 hours)- as well as or better than do those of LSD.

Thus, it appears that DOB could have been the psychotomimetic agent encountered by the patient described by Dr. Lake and associates. In view of this possibility, their description might better have been of "mania associated with ingestion of a psychotomimetic (or hallucinogenic) agent."

REFERENCES


Delliou D: Bromo-DMA: new hallucinogenic drug. Med J Aust 1:83,1980
Shulgin AT, Sargent T, Naranjo C: 4-Bromo-2,5-dimethoxyphenylisopropylamine, a new centrally active amphetamine analog. Pharmacology 5:103-107, 1971
Jaffe IH: Drug addiction and drug abuse, in The Pharmacological Basis of Therapeutics, 5th ed. Edited by Goodman L, Gilman A. New York, Macmillan Publishing Co, 1975
Sargent T. Kalbhen DA, Shulgin AT, et al: In vivo human pharmacodynamics of the psychodysleptic 4-Br-2.5-dimethoxyphenylisopropylamine labelled with 82Br or 77Br. Neuropharmacology 14:165-174, 1975
W. MARVIN DAVIS, PH.D.
University, Miss.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Dr. Lake and Ms. Moriarty Reply
SIR: It is possible that the drug ingested by our patient, Mr. A, was not LSD but, rather, 4-bromo-2,5-dimethoxyamphetamine (DOB). We thank Dr. Davis for suggesting I)OB as a possible alternative. one that we had not considered. However. we believe it is likely that Mr. A did, in fact, ingest LSD.

The relevant issue is the frequency with which DOB is sold as LSD in the United States. Some statistics are available from PharmChem Laboratories, a public service drug analysis laboratory that publishes information about street drugs (1). Of 76 street samples of alleged LSD received by PharmChem in 1980, 64 (84%) contained exclusively LSD. Only 4 of the 76 samples (5.2%) contained drugs other than LSD.

If Mr. A had ingested DOB, it is uncertain whether the dose would have been potent enough to cause the perceptual distortions de- scribed in our report. In the clinical tests described by Shulgin and associates, a dose of 2.0 mg of DOB caused no perceptual distortion in humans. According to Dr. Davis, U.S. street samples of DOB average .93-2.8 mg per dosage unit. Thus, the most potent dose Mr. A would be likely to have taken, 2.8 mg, is only .8 mg greater than a dose that caused no perceptual distortion in human. Also, LSD (as well as DOB) fits the description of time until symptom onset in our case. Because DOB doses in the United States are relatively small and substitutes were apparently infrequently sold as LSD in the United States in 1980, it is probable that our patient ingested LSD.

In conclusion, we feel that the evidence point to LSD as the drug in question but fully agree that without a positive urine drug screen no positive identification can be made. That other potent hallucinogenic drugs can be distributed on blotter paper is important because treatment of overdose with amphetamine (or an amphetamine analogue such as DOB) differs from that of LSD overdose.

REFERENCE

1. Ogden D: The 1980 drug analysis report. PharmChem Newsletter, vol 10, number 4. July-August, 1981

C. RAYMOND LAKE. M.D., PH.D.
KATHLEEN MORIARTY
Bethesda, Md.

ways of telling the difference its bitter it takes an houre just to start and 2 to peak. when it acid you can feal in minutes even though it peaks at hour 45 min. and you feal ok the next day compaired to dob. so watch out there are bad people out there ready to rip you off to bad my friend got taken for all he had. he took this shit to earth dance and family tested it in the on bus lab and it came out as dob. so watch out its coming out of chico SF. WA. SO HEAD UP MY PEEPS. iv done a cosed eye test 5 people dosed on dob half on lsd all people partaken in the event are extremly experenced, just not with dob for the best rsponse to the test. all but 1 questioned that they where on lsd from the test the drugs are too alike. the next day i told every one the the experament was to see the placibo effect of the blotter papper verse the effects of the dom. they where suprized they thought they took sum kind of white fluff and fluffs normal effects takes a long time and is very clean high like the dob with out the bitternes.so all my friend thought it was a kind of acid.

more info http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/dob/dob.shtml

FUCK BITTER ACID DONT BUY IT! SO THE PEOPLE IN CONTROLE HAVE TO CLEAN UP THERE ACT. IF WE DONT BUY THERE CRAPY BATCHES OR ADULTERATED CRYSTALL THERE HAVE TO CHANGE. DO IT FOR THE TRIBE MY FELLOW PSYCONAUGHTS THIS IS FOR OUR FUTARE OUR KIDS

REVOLUTION ONLY BUY CLEAN ACID. HAVE THE PEOPLE THAT ARE RIPPING OFF OUR COMUNNITY LOSS FUNDING BAD ACID = ERGOT POISENING VERY BAD
WATCH OUT FOR THO DOB DOM DOI DOET AND OTHERS IN BLOTER FORM

[neeb]

this an important issue pleas help our comunity

[rocketman]

I have had some great blotter lately. Maybe a problem if you don't know what to look for, but luckily I have friends that know. Bogus acid has been around a long time, remember at Woodstock, "don't eat the brown acid." It is always better to know who you are buying from, and that goes with any drug.

I too am thankful for my blotter source as it was very very good lsd.

I agree that its all in if you know your source and they know what they are getting.

I know I don't want the DOB, just the LSD Gangrene, hell know
Thanks for the article!

[wovotom]

how would i recognise actual lsd tabs then??

I guess you just gotta know the guys that put the crystal down...

ain't dat da truth!

[Venice]

Man, I miss acid...count yourselves fortunate that still have a good source.

[skullfarmer]

i came across some paper back in may,took 2 hits and tripped for 2 days.i knew after the first day it must have been a r.c. and not cid.i enjoyed the first day but by the second i had started thinking i had lost my mind so i started to freak a little.
the chem i took wasnt bad.in fact it was very good but hard to endure.2 hits was 2much.

[dead_diver]

LSD does have a taste to it that is hard to describe. It tastes slightly bitter but the dead give away for me that it is real acid are the spine shakes I get as soon as the paper hits my mouth. I wonder if DOB gives the chills like acid does? BTW not everyone is able to taste acid. My friend can't taste a thing and doesn't get chills on the same acid that will make me shake like a wet dog.

It always taste to me like I licked a 9 volt battery or something. I know what you mean Diver Those shakes and shivers,

[dead_diver]

Yes a weak 9V battery is a good description I don't understand why some people are immune to the taste and the chills but they seem to get off fine anyways.

[lyqwyd]

i got that DOB shit at camp bisco this summer... tab with what looked like thin red and blue lines arranged in a wavy geometric pattern... I thought it was some wierd tryptamine. guess not. i cant taste acid, nor do i shiver... still works tho. works GOOD....

[rocketman]

to me acid has a distinct metallic taste, there is no other taste like it.

[neeb]

Originally Posted by skullfarmer

i came across some paper back in may,took 2 hits and tripped for 2 days.i knew after the first day it must have been a r.c. and not cid.i enjoyed the first day but by the second i had started thinking i had lost my mind so i started to freak a little.
the chem i took wasnt bad.in fact it was very good but hard to endure.2 hits was 2much.

hey bro there is this shit called dragonfly our bromo-d-fly so watch out it has no tast an its in the 200 mic rage for high poetency

SO WHEN YOUR ON A FIELD DAY AND YOU COME ACROS DOSES AND IT IS JUST THE SLIGHT BIT TARTNES CAN IT BE ACID JUST MADE IN A CRUMBY ROOM LAB. OUR ACID CAN HAVE A METELIC TAST. BACK WHEN I GOT DOSES THEY WOULD BE TASTLES NOT TAST AT ALL MANYOU CAN EAT A 10 AND JUST HAVE THAT SLIGHT WEIRD BLOOD TAST. SO WHAT GOING ON WITH TODAY ACID. BESIDES THE BUST THAT SCRUEEWED EVERY THING UP WILE STRENGTHING OUR WEAKNES WITH OUR SMALL FAMILEY LABRITORYS. LOOK 2000 WE LOST MOST OF OUR ACID SUPPLY IN THE BUST. BUT SINCE THEN WE ARE ALMOST BACK IN FORCE

[I_am_me]

I swear, its strange how the youths of today just don't seem to eat acid. Back when I was 16-20 I ate tons. So many people I know now just never had it and either eat shrooms or E. The kids need an acid revolution.

[neeb]

Originally Posted by lyqwyd

i got that DOB shit at camp bisco this summer... tab with what looked like thin red and blue lines arranged in a wavy geometric pattern... I thought it was some wierd tryptamine. guess not. i cant taste acid, nor do i shiver... still works tho. works GOOD....

[removed by admin]

[neeb]

YA THEY DO MAN THE REVOLUTION IS UPRISING

[Hippie3]

neeb
turn off the caps lock
or you will lose your posting privs here.

[neeb]

hippi my friends half dead and your saying not to try to put an awarness of the people making this deadly paper its not lsd man it dob way more toxic

people can die people will die and your ignorince to the subject wont help

look bro my friend is on a resperator! theses people are not people they are rip offs and killers

[shedthemonkey]

Neeb, bro, I think you took Hip all wrong.
He was just talking about how difficult it is
for us stoned people
to read WHEN IT ALL LOOKS LIKE A TELEPROMPTOR.
It is Net Manners to not appear to YELL AT PEOPLE!!!
He didn't say nothing about posting the story above,
that, if true, will help people avoid a bummer sit-chuation.
the info was fine, and THANK YOU for posting it.

So chill a bit. Here's a nice fattie...go smoke it. <=============>

ShedTheMonkey

[neeb]

o bro its not abought the caps that was my mistake it was the he erased what i put out im trying to put a stop to this dob from this specific blotter sorce the other meber here liqued and many others gotthis dob mess and i know the coad name that this prick goes buy not saying that im going to leel cuz hippie dont want me to help get an awarness

look i come from the days when we take half sheets thumb or pinky prints and just flow. but with dob you cant do this and because of the groop who is screewing us acid heads over me and my friend ate half a sheet at a party in the woods i hade dragoon blotter he had sum different shit kalidoscopes they where called same shit on the microgram buleten i just found. but i tripped balles he overdosed bad he was shaking like a fish and eyes in the back of his head friend had to take him to the hospital.

but see i took 50 hits of real acid and had no down effect except from hangover and brain fry

[dead_diver]

DOM (4-Methyl-2,5-dimethoxyamphetamine) was introduced to the San Francisco drug scene in the late 1960's and given the nickname "STP," an acronym for "Serenity, Tranquility, and Peace." Doses of 1 to 3 milligrams generally produce mood alterations and minor perceptual alterations while larger doses can produce pronounced hallucinations that last from 8 to 10 hours.

Other illicitly manufactured analogues include 4-bromo-2,5-dimethoxyamphetamine (DOB), 3,4-methylenedioxyamphetamine (MDA), 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA), and 4-bromo-2,5-dimethoxyphenethylamine (2C-B, NEXUS). These drugs differ from one another in their potency, speed of onset, duration of action, and their capacity to modify mood with or without producing overt hallucinations. The drugs are usually taken orally but are sometimes snorted or injected (rarely). Because they are produced in clandestine laboratories, they are seldom pure and the amount of the drug in a capsule or tablet is likely to vary considerably.

[dead_diver]

If I remember my history right STP aka DOM wasn't very popular due to the the trip being too heavy and lasting too long. Read somewhere that effects could last up to 3 days, but this is the first I have heard of it being toxic.

[Venice]

I was sold STP in place of acid just after it was first "introduced". I've heard the original batch was about 15000 hits of which I was sold one. It looked like an Orange Owsley barrel but with black specks. No one had heard of STP then and I didn't know what happened happened to me until quite awhile after. Even though I was only 16 at the time (some 35+ years ago), I'd had enough acid experience to know within an hour that this was much different. One tab of STP is more like 4 or 5 tabs of acid, whatever the doses were then. But not only was the inrensity turned up so much, the shit goes on forever. When you get a 24 hr, full on, the world is melting peak, you definitely think you've REALLY DONE IT this time!

I won't bore you with anymore details but that STP or DOM needs serious mental preparation prior to dropping... no doubt. I don't think I'd mind doing it again though...just less.

[neeb]

please keep this thread on dob because it is what is being put on blotter by anuber of groops cuz u can fit a hit in a quater inch hit

not to sound mean id just like to keep it to the dob blotter thing cause my friend is in a hospital because of the rip off ass holes that put him in a coma

[shedthemonkey]

Originally Posted by neeb

please keep this thread on dob because it is what is being put on blotter by anuber of groops cuz u can fit a hit in a quater inch hit

not to sound mean id just like to keep it to the dob blotter thing cause my friend is in a hospital because of the rip off ass holes that put him in a coma

I realize you are concerned for your friend, and it really sucks that he is in the hospital but perhaps this can be a cautionary tale also. Disrespecting one's own body by ingesting unknown substances in admittedly large doses even if it were gonna REALLY be LSD, in an uncontrolled setting is chancy at best and playing russion roulette with your body and mind. Part of the responsibility has to be in your friend's choices. Assholes will always try to take advantage of us, so that makes your posting of this info very good for those of us with some caution.

Please don't think I am trying to belittle your friend's situation as I send much prayers and good vibes his way.

Tripping is fun and rewarding, but make sure you can come down safely.

[Lefty]

The sad thing is the asshole making it knows damn well, and those distributing have to have heard feedback. Someone needs beat down for fucking up a wonderful thing. I remember when etiquette dictated you chomped your own shit first...
Hope your friend gets better. Very nasty reminder to never buy if you don't know where it came from.

[Hippie3]

my position is that we have no way to know if the 'name' that neeb wants to provide is actually guilty of anything,
for all we know the dude fucked neeb's ol lady and he's out
passing out the guy's name, trying to get other people to
do his dirty work for him.
i'm not going to permit him or anyone to use this board
to spread malicious gossip when the facts are in doubt.

Neeb, I hope your friend makes a strong recovery and that word has gotten around your general area about your source selling DOB instead of LSD. I'm sending prayers and good vibes your friends way as well.

I do agree with Hippie, its not right to slander someones name on this board like that. All you can do is give the caution and warning, which you did and I for one am thankful for. That DOB trip doesn't sound like a trip I wanna take anytime.

i'll try anything once

[Venice]

isn't that sense of adventure and curiosity how most of us got here in the first place?

too bad about the sick one though...

sorry, I'll try things that have been tested and trusted by a good source once, but gangrene, hospitalisation, that doesn't sound like too much fun, especially when they aren't telling you what kind of trip to expect.

[Jonah]

i would actually prefer dob blotter. weird, huh?

[Lefty]

At the same time I bet you'd like to know what it actually is. Eating a shitload expecting one thing, winding up in the hospital finding out it isn't is very fucked up. I'd never eat a handful of anything I didn't know through personal experience or a trusted advisor whom knows their shit, consider that inviting disaster and in that I agree w/Freaky totally. I've had acid that two hits was almost too much, had me hanging onto the floor. Other stuff quickly forgotten about.
Hip is also right about naming anyone w/o out proof. How many times have you heard someone call someone else a rat w/o proof at all or for personal reasons? Rumors and unfounded/malicious slander don't fly, but if you can prove it thats totally different. Thanks for the word of caution, valuable in and of itself.

[Psychenaut]

DOB like most Phenythalimes has a very distinct bitter taste. I guess if you can, if you use this class of substances, it's worth taking the time to bite into the pill/crystal and taste it. . and file that flavor away in your brain! If you get blotter that is actually DOB, YOU WILL KNOW, it doesn't give your mouth that metalic tang, and it's taste is rather strong. . that's the first sign right off.

This is not a "FOR SURE" but typically, those of us that are involved in commited psychedelic circles are relatively safe when it comes to what we get. "Our" people tend to be conscience about being sketchy with eachother, so bad crap rarely makes it our way. It's more youth, and wreckless folks out for a new high that are going through whoever says can supply them. . that need to be causious about this sort of thing.

Personally I've found the Phenyth. class of chemical very interesting and some even beneficial in my exploration of existance and expeirnece but still, I'd want to know what I'm getting. . the possibilty of dosing to high with that stuff is way to real. If you think you are doing a 400 to 100mcg LSD trip but you are actually doing an 8 to 10mg DOB trip. . you are in some deep shit! That's a very strong dose of DOB. nevermind the possiblity it's DOM ect 8-O

[Psychenaut]

Even better....

It's time for the world to completely legalise Psychedelics and Enthogens, so those of us (being we have the right to do what we wish when it comes to our own bodies and minds), could make informed choices on what we are ingesting and the precise dose we choose to do! We have the right to do so in the constitution. it's time we demanded it. . take it to the supream courts if we have too.

Parent's that are conserned for little johny could feel safe in knowing that the pharmacist with a licensed and monitored is the one selling the substances to adults and no longer risking the chance that some opertunistic "drug" dealer that will make a buck anyway he can.

[skullfarmer]

im with jasontokes,i'll try anything once.and neeb,you mention the bromo-dragonfly? I WANT IT!!! I GOT TO HAVE IT NOW!! (skull wipes drool from chin)

[Jonah]

Originally Posted by lefty

At the same time I bet you'd like to know what it actually is.

oh yeah, totally.

this is why i love pills so much they have drug imprint codes on each one thanks to or friendly FDA . of course its not like you can find sandoz labs lsd anymore . best advise is now your source . buying drugs off some fuck on the street corner is never a good idea in the first place . never understood the whole standing on the corner slinging dope . bad scene .
later VII

[Venice]

sometimes we can stoop to some pretty low levels to get the needed supplies. I won't do it but I'll tell you that I'm in that situation as we speak, living in a new town and not knowing a soul. the only things I can get are what can be purchased from the legal high sites which isn't anywhere near what's desired.

Thanks to what I've learned on the Internet I have some irons in the fire on the propogation end but a few hits of acid would mean alot to me right about now.

So where is that shithead on the street corner? :-) STP would do as well (as long as I knew ahead of time).