Quantum Theory of Immortality

[Ras Asad]

this is from a friend, and i thought i would share it, as i know alot of you are some deep thinkers. lol
this is the kinda stuff i think about all the time.. lol

The Quantum Theory of Immortality

The Everett 'Many Worlds Interpretation' of quantum physics postulates that that all systems evolve according to the Schrödinger equation, whereas the more conventional Copenhagen Interpretation says that this is true until the moment of observation, at which point the equation 'collapses'. The proposed paper examines some philosophical questions arising from the MWI interpretation. From the Tegmark (1997) 'quantum suicide' experiment and the Stapp (1998) analysis of the quantum effects on calcium ions in neural synapses, MWI may imply a 'Quantum Theory of Immortality' (QTI).

http://www.higgo.com/quantum/qti.htm

This summarizes the thought experiment (quantum suicide) and its possible implications on first person experience.

For those who don't want to read, it goes like this:
GIVEN:
1) Quantum probability dictates that for certain subatomic particles a seemingly random choice is made (spin up or down) in a given situation.
2) That for every quantum decision arbitrarily made (assuming they are arbitrary), a new universe is created wherein the opposite choice was made
3) You cannot experience your own death, assuming that death would destroy the parts of the brain that create (the illusion of?) consciousness. This itself is dependent on the idea that there is no afterlife, and that we don't somehow continue to consciously experience things after death in some other way. In short, because you cannot experience the ceasing of consciousness through death, you cannot experience death (notwithstanding Near Death Experiences, I'm referring to the moment of total brain death/destruction).
4) Thought experiment: Given 1, 2 and 3, if you design an apparatus that shoots a bullet when a trigger is pulled, and the trigger operates using a quantum switch that will choose to fire 50% of the time and make a click 50% of the time, and if you, the experiencer, step in front of this apparatus and have your assistant pull the trigger 10 times, all you, the experiencer in front of the muzzle, will experience is 10 clicks, because you cannot experience your own death, and so from your own standpoint the quantum switch always chooses to dud. To your assistant however, you will have died each time, but in a parallel universe. So the thought experiment says that after the first trigger, you sigh in relief, and the assistant in your universe does as well, but another universe is created where your assistant goes for the mop and bucket. After the second trigger pulling, you would sigh again in relief, your assistant would as well, and another new universe is created where you survived the first trigger but not the second.
RESULTING IMPLICATION:
I, Vigilo, am Immortal. You, the reader, from your vantage point of your consciousness, are as well. However, you can die in "my" universe, and I can die in "yours."

My best friend since the 2nd grade and I have spent probably a collective 100+ hours discussing the dynamics and implications of this theory.

I'd like to see everyone's thoughts on this idea. Since a lot of people believe in an afterlife/souls, this theory may have little relevance to their worldview.

Some ideas we had were:

* If the qualia, the experience (a being that experiences is conscious, as opposed to something that "senses." Sorry for the semantic spiderweb, but I hope this gets the distinction across), of the universe is isolated in the self, is my universe separate from Jane's universe? That is, am I experiencing in the same exact universe as Jane? This is a tricky tightrope, because the implication of Jane having her own universe is that nobody in my universe is actually conscious but myself. This seems counterintuitive (why do they seem to be conscious just like me), unless we decide that the brain can emulate a being with qualia without actually having qualia. Again, these have rather sociopathic implications, but are nontheless relevant.

* If qualia is present in all other people in "my" universe, then this suggests that in order for the QTI to be true, there exists certain points of divergence where people die in my universe and cease to exist as consciousnesses "plugged in" to my universe. Their consciousness wouldn't cease; rather, they continue on as if they hadn't died, but in another universe.

* In order for the QTI to be true, there would have to be a physical reason for my immortality, since the QTI is based on physics in the first place, and so it follows that theres seems to be an unending list of ways, both likely and unlikely, that I should achieve (or have achieved) this immortality. For example, I may have been born with a set of extremely rare birth defects that make all the natural aging processes fail, and which also work to counteract all of the environmental causes of aging. I may have been born in just the right time in human history to live long enough for technology to give humanity immortality. ETs might land in my backyard and leave me a fountain of youth. Who knows? But it seems that some outcomes are more likely than others. And this only covers anti-aging, after all, there are infinite more reasons why I would eventually die than just aging, especially since I'm supposed to live, well, forever right? So my friend and I decided that for the experiencer, there exists a level of "corniness" as we call it, a measure of how unlikely the circumstances in the universe have become from common human perception. At some certain junction, you "break your corniness lid" and it becomes apparent to yourself and everyone in your universe that something is seriously special about you. Maybe you somehow survive a 10 story drop from a building. Maybe you aren't aging. From that point on, we theorize that the corniness in your universe increases exponentially. Inotherwords, the odds that you continue to survive become increasingly stacked against you at an exponential rate. We say corny because, after 1000 years, some of the reasons you continue to survive may be downright ridiculous.

* Is QTI violated if you're hit by a truck, rendering you mentally disabled but still conscious, and you still live forever? If so, maybe Hell really does exist. Of course this scenario seems unlikely, because at least according to the physical situation in this universe its a reasonable assumption that gains in intelligence may be a common necessary "excuse" for your inability to die (and not just fail to age). Becoming a mentally disabled person wouldn't be conducive to you being protected from harm or death, unless some external caretaker could fulfill this roll. In which case it's possible that there are malicious extra dimensional ETs that like to torture/stupify people and force them to live forever by leaving behind some apparatus that keeps them alive forever, protecting them from aging and harm. Yeah, not very nice.

* Is QTI violated if your consciousness is modified to such a degree that we can no longer speak of qualia the way we do now? Tremendous gains in intelligence would surely change the way we experience things. What if you become so intelligent that "consciousness" is only a small, perhaps insignificant part of your universe experience at this point (hard to fathom or quantify just what could supersede consciousness, but who knows right)?

* What happens if I build a device that links my consciousness with someone elses? A neural internet, for example. Or a human hive mind (think borg, but benevolent). Will this "save" all the other conscious minds into my universe such that they can no longer diverge from mine? Especially if I sync our vitals, so that if one of my "borg buddies" dies, we all die. Either the device would have to fail in killing me in particular, for some improbable reason, perhaps a seemingly impossible reason, or otherwise would my buddies not remain immortal in my universe as well?

* If interdimensional travel is possible, what happens if I leave "my" universe and join another? What are the implications of this for QTI?

* What happens if our universe collides with another universe. Recent astrophysicist research has, startlingly, began looking for signs of just such a thing. Since the idea is that everything that could exist does somewhere in the multiverse (collection of floating universes), it follows that there are a infinite number of universes whose physical laws are outright incompatible with QTI or even life itself. Will my universe "dodge" these ones? If so, doesn't that imply that the QTI is not a property of "my universe" or even "the universe" but the multiverse as a whole?

[Lookyhere]

If this were the case, then that would mean that out there in another universe there is a guy with the pseudo name "don'tlookyhere" on some DEA or some anti-drug website. "don'tlookyhere" is living a pretty fantastic life filled with awesome decisions. That's about all that popped into my head at the moment on this.

[Ras Asad]

[dice4717]

Ive never really thought into that deep b4 Ras.
I could see how people would though.
It is very intriguing stuff, if you can get into it.
Saying though like you can die in my universe,
and I can die in yours, but not our own.
I dont feel like this I feel like when you die
your body your mind your soul for most people
does know they have past.
I do believe that there are some that dont,
and in that sense are Immortal,
but thats not the kinda immortal id wanna be.
Like I said I dont know to much so I shouldnt say to much.
Thats just my 2cents.
I bookmarked the link its something I'd like to look into more though.
Thanks Ras

[kyle2892]

you just tore my brain a new one

[indierail]

Reality is a singular perception.

That's the my universe, your universe thing. I guess I could be walking around and creating everyone else and their appearance of conscienceness. That could explain why people in general have become increasingly less human, less intelligent. So many have to be created as the numbers grow that their complexity must suffer based on quantity.

I never have understood why every other possibility has to happen in another universe thing; why? If you make a choice then no alternates exist. It also stands to reason that up until they didn't exist they were yours as you know the one you live in and weren't there to begin with so I don't get the plural, multi-faceted, every choice has a time thing.

I have thought on occasion about the possibility of being the only "real" thing in my reality. Conscienceness is a state of being but not the only state of being; that's how we share space in a single universe while living in two.

Most people don't know the difference between empathy and sympathy. I guess empathy is reality and sympathy is nonsense. I try to understand what someone else is going through with the understanding that I'll never really know.

I'm rambling now; cool theory.

[eatyualive]

lol@ what looky said. good read.

kinda similar to string theory in a way..

we could all just be in the matrix who knows...but it wouldn't be a computer matrix it would be a flesh matrix...

so our bodies could be our mode of transportation and right now we are taking a ride....

im hoping to make this ride last bc life rocks!

[ez_goin]

Great thought-provoking theories. I will have to think in terms of these ideas and get back to this thread. I am also interested in other thoughts along these lines.

[Hippie3]

classic example of taking something out of context
and misapplying it to 'prove' some pet belief-
quantum theory has become
the new ager's bible-
used to prove anything they want.

the very foundation of this 'immortality theory'
is the misapplication of what happens on the
quantum level to subatomic particles
to macro level lifeforms,
kind of like how preachers take snippets meant
for the israelites 2500 years ago
and apply it to themselves here and now.

quite a leap there,
and done entirely
without a net .

[Subbalteatus]

I agree that the principles of this theory are two unrelated. Amen to what hip said about the New Agers.... Nuff Sed.

However about preachers likening the stories in the Bible in an applicable way to our lives and choices.. You would be wise to do the same. That is not like relating quantum theory and universes to our choices and perception. Kind of a far reach there Hip.

Peace,
subbal.

[Hippie3]

However about preachers likening the stories in the Bible in an applicable way to our lives and choices.. You would be wise to do the same. That is not like relating quantum theory and universes to our choices and perception. Kind of a far reach there Hip.

not really,
you just missed my meaning-
not talking about moral principles,
i more mean stuff like
using the prohibition to the israelites
not to eat blood
then twisted by some to
justify the modern prohibition
against blood transfusions.
or how some sects eschew medicine for faith healing,
or play with poison snakes, etc.

[Subbalteatus]

Well Im with you there.. Thats a bunch of crap..

[Ras Asad]

cool, thanks for the thoughts guys.
kinda what i was aiming for, as i dont know exactly what to think about all this stuff either.

I do understand what you mean Hip. thanx,
you always seem to open some doors that i havent yet found.


i got some thinking to do..... lol

to you all.