Late-fall Oyster, ID help? [Panellus serotinus?]

[alterego158]

I've found what looks to be a fairly large colony of late-fall oysters. I'm not 100% on that ID though. I'll be taking a spore print soon, but maybe someone can tell me I'm wrong on the ID from these pictures?

Sorry for the quality of the first picture, it was the best of the bunch.

On another note, this (and many other mushrooms) are said to have amyloid spores. Would I just swab the print with iodine and look for a change in color, or is there some other way to test for this feature?

Thanks for any help/info.

[Hippie3]

not an expert by any means
but that doesn't look quite right, imo.

this is-

[alterego158]

Originally Posted by Hippie3

not an expert by any means
but that doesn't look quite right, imo.

Woah! I have to say that doesn't look much like the pictures I've seen of this mushroom. Is that Panellus Serotinus? From my field guide:

"Caps are 2-10 cm across, semi-circular to kidney-shaped, slippery when wet, smooth, yelow-green to olive, and with an inrolled, striate margine. Gills are thin, close, and white to pale tan-yellow. Stalks are short, broad, laterally attached. Spore print is white and amyloid."

A quick google image search didn't come up with any pictures that looked quite like that...

I'm no expert either of course, which is why this thread is here.

[siam_jim]

most if not all oyster gills run down the stems as it fades..like the one in hips pic
siam

[max]

If I had to guess I'd also say Panellus serotinus, the Late Oyster Mushroom. The stalk is absent on this mushroom or very short and the gills mostly adnate. I've found this mushroom myself, it is a mediocre edible. The colours of the cap kind of shimmer like looking at a puddle of gasoline.

[Hippie3]

some examples of Panellus serotinus, the Late Oyster Mushroom that i found online-

[alterego158]

Originally Posted by siam_jim

most if not all oyster gills run down the stems as it fades..like the one in hips pic
siam

Well, this one in specific is not a pleurotus so it won't necessarily have the decurrent gills of the oyster.

[alterego158]

Originally Posted by Hippie3

some examples of Panellus serotinus, the Late Oyster Mushroom that i found online-

I checked those out too. Some of them look quite similar, though others quite different. I guess that's why ID based on macroscopic features is often shaky at best.

[alterego158]

Originally Posted by captainmax

If I had to guess I'd also say Panellus serotinus, the Late Oyster Mushroom. The stalk is absent on this mushroom or very short and the gills mostly adnate. I've found this mushroom myself, it is a mediocre edible. The colours of the cap kind of shimmer like looking at a puddle of gasoline.

Are the shimmering colours you describe present when the cap is dry or only when it's moist? They definitely get slimy when wet, which is a characteristic of the late oyster.

I've read different accounts about how good of an edible this is. Many said they're fairly mediocre as well, but at least one said they're choice. Different strokes for different folks I guess!

[Hippie3]

Late Fall Oyster Mushrooms (Panellus serotinus) prepared for a cooking. Skinned and chopped mushrooms can be stored frozen until use.

[max]

Thats when it's wet. Some have short stubby stalks and the gills can run down slightly. They are in the Pleurotus genus, same as regular oysters. I hear they make a great laxative!

i believe those to be panellus serotinus, sporeprint should be white. it will also be amyloid....which means if you introduce a 2% tincture of iodine to a small pile of spores on a clean piece of glass, they should turn bluish black.

[alterego158]

Originally Posted by captainmax

Thats when it's wet. Some have short stubby stalks and the gills can run down slightly. They are in the Pleurotus genus, same as regular oysters. I hear they make a great laxative!

Hmm, well, I suppose that's... medicinal...

Panellus != Pleurotus though, or am I missing something? I think the common name of "Late Oyster" or "Late-Fall Oyster" or "Fall Oyster" is pretty confusing. Perhaps we should call it the "Laxative Oyster".

*Edit* Well, http://www.messiah.edu/Oakes/fungi_o...0serotinus.htm
lists Pleurotus Serotinus as a synonym. I'll have to see if I can find anything elucidating the distinctions between these genuses.

[alterego158]

Originally Posted by greysRDbest

i believe those to be panellus serotinus, sporeprint should be white. it will also be amyloid....which means if you introduce a 2% tincture of iodine to a small pile of spores on a clean piece of glass, they should turn bluish black.

Is this something that will only be noticeable microscopically? Or if there's a sufficiently dense pile of spores will it be visibly blue to the naked eye?

[max]

Panellus is not a genus, it is a specie in the Pleurotus genus along with Panus and Pleurotus species. The nomenculture can be very confusing. Some books may mention Panellus as being in Hohenbuehelia, an ally of Pleurotus. Bottom line is...it's edible!

if you have enough spores...naked eye. usually a magnifying glass or jewelers loupe is good enough though

[alterego158]

Originally Posted by captainmax

Panellus is not a genus, it is a specie in the Pleurotus genus along with Panus and Pleurotus species. The nomenculture can be very confusing. Some books may mention Panellus as being in Hohenbuehelia, an ally of Pleurotus. Bottom line is...it's edible!

Hmm, apparently it is quite confusing. Thanks for that clarification, I guess I thought I understood the nomenclature more than I did. So if Panellus is the specie, the Serotinus is called what?

*edit*
In trying to figure this out I've come across speciesfungorum.org. This site lists the Pleurotus genus here:http://www.speciesfungorum.org/Names...RecordID=18308 and the Panellus genus here: http://www.speciesfungorum.org/Names...RecordID=18178 and the two genera are in fact in different families Panellus being a member of Tricholomataceae and Pleurotus in Pleurotaceae.

This site seems like a pretty useful tool for learning the nomenclature as well as the type species for various genera etc.

[alterego158]

Just to update folks I brought home a mushroom today and I am printing it. I have to get some iodine for the melzers reaget test. Anybody know if the iodine sold is generally a 2% solution or will I need to dilute it down myself? (greysRDbest I'm looking in your general direction )

[Workman]

Those are definately Panellus serotinus (the stem stub is distinctive).
Panellus is the genus, not Pleurotus.
They are edible and I have never experienced a laxative effect.
Some collections can be a little bitter.
If well cooked I think they taste somewhat like fried summer squash.

The purple oyster image is mine and is of Panus conchatus, not Panellus.

I attempted to clone one years ago and failed, but I have seen a success before with fruits eventually resulting. I have also had trouble getting a decent sporeprint from these in the past.

[max]

Yes, further research shows that Panellus is now regarded as it's own genus.

>Panellus serotinus used to be in the same genus as the oyster mushroom.



But not exactly a choice edible...

>It must be noted that two members of Spokane Mushroom Club have reported >nausea and stomach upset from eating Panellus serotinus.

[alterego158]

Originally Posted by Workman

Those are definately Panellus serotinus (the stem stub is distinctive).
Panellus is the genus, not Pleurotus.
They are edible and I have never experienced a laxative effect.
Some collections can be a little bitter.
If well cooked I think they taste somewhat like fried summer squash.

The purple oyster image is mine and is of Panus conchatus, not Panellus.

I attempted to clone one years ago and failed, but I have seen a success before with fruits eventually resulting. I have also had trouble getting a decent sporeprint from these in the past.

Well I've come down with a nasty cold, but if I'm able to get out in the woods again before these guys disappear I'll gather some for dinner and let you know how I like 'em. In that link hip posted they had peeled the top layer before cooking, would you reccomend that workman?

So far I haven't gotten them to sporulate as of yet, but I've got my fingers crossed.

[max]

Definately peel the skin. With boletes for instance, the skin is the part that works best as a laxative. And I bet if you look around a bit you'll find something recognized as being a better edible...

[alterego158]

Originally Posted by captainmax

Definately peel the skin. With boletes for instance, the skin is the part that works best as a laxative. And I bet if you look around a bit you'll find something recognized as being a better edible...

Well I picked yellow chantarelles and black chantarelles in the summer, a king bolete or two, various edible puffballs, some biporus, and a few Pleurotus oysters lately, but it's gotten awfully cold here as of late so choice edibles are few and far between. I also have a lawn full of Tippler's Bane though it's too cold for those now too.

[Workman]

I never peeled them, but its not a bad idea. When the Late Fall oysters are out, not as many other good edibles are available. But there are a few. Try looking for Winter Chanterelles (Cantharellus infundibuliformis group, also C. tubaeformis) and Hedge Hogs (Dentinum repandum and D. umbilicatum). Good luck!